29 Replies Latest reply on Dec 7, 2017 1:12 AM by calebalexander

    Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!

    442mike

      Registered here just to post this.  I manage the IT department for a mid-size business.  Many of our machines use Windows 10.  Many of our machines use AMD Radeon R7 250 video cards for dual monitors.  I downloaded the latest driver yesterday (whql-radeon-software-crimson-relive-17.9.3-win10-64bit-oct2.exe).  When I went to install it it did the usual check and gave me the option to install 17.10.1, instead.  I chose this and chose "Clean install", as I've been doing for years.  After the systems rebooted and driver installation finished I noticed that they were missing all their printers.  No error messages, no services stopped, rebooting again did not help.  It was as if every printer on the system had simply been right-clicked and removed.  This problem is identical and consistent on six different machines (all Dell OptiPlex business-class systems with a variety of network-connected HP enterprise printers, also running the latest  drivers from HP).

       

      Not sure what the issue is, nothing shows up in the event logs, but I'm having to reinstall a lot of printers today.  :-(

        • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
          spikeypup

          I know silly question maybe, but did you notice if the printers were already gone before you installed the driver, the reason I ask is that Patch Tuesday is today, and MS started pushing out  "2017-10 Cumulative Update for Windows 10 Version 1703 for x64-based Systems (KB4041676)" late Monday night actually, there were some changes particularly for Citrix based or Redirected Printer environments that caused the removal of printers or inability to print, there were also a lot of changes that were not described and this may have just been a coincidence between your AMD installation and the Cumulative update, especially if they were downloaded and the computer was in a ready to update state upon shutdown/restart. 

           

          Did you notice at all when they were restarting that it took longer and was doing the "Windows is updating Files" shebang?  If so it may have been that Patch update from MS that did this, or very distant possibility that the mix of the two things, that update pending for commit and the clean install of the AMD driver just colliding in a bad and unforeseen way.  Are you running an Active Directory Domain, Tree, or Forest?  Were these printers locally installed or are they running from a print server or are they objects in an Active Directory container?

           

          This would be the first time I've seen a GPU software update/change cause something to go wrong in the Print Render Subsystem or Spooler/Print Server arena, but nothing really shocks me anymore to be honest, so many of these classically isolated systems are becoming so intertwined and woven that who knows anymore to be honest...

           

          BTW did you check the following logs as well in the following branches of the Event Viewer in the "Windows" sub-branch as shown?

           

          Anyway let me know, this is an interesting one for sure!

           

          Spikeypup

          2 of 2 people found this helpful
            • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
              442mike

              Hi!  Thanks for the followup.  Those are some good suggestions, especially about the Patch Tuesday updates.  I think one of PC's had already run them, and five more PC's ran them later, but I didn't notice if they might've been directly related to all the printers disappearing.  That would be quite a collison - the patches + the clean install, but I can see what you're getting at!

               

              To answer some of your other questions, we're not running anything Citrix related.  Standard Windows Active Directory domain, but the printers are all added with the HP universal printer driver directly via their IP addresses (not through AD). Everything was gone though not just the HP stuff -- even the generic Microsoft "Print to PDF" printer was gone.

               

              As a test I think I'll try reinstalling the AMD driver again but am not sure I'll be able to duplicate these exact conditions.  Maybe Uninstall 17.10.1, reinstall an older version, then try the installer update again with the same options?  Stay tuned, this could be exciting!  ;-)

                • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                  spikeypup

                  Very intriguing, keep me posted!  Strange about the MS PDF, but at the same time not really, they were trying to update it to a new renderer and there was a bug in their deployment appx package, lol, so it could cause the printer to be uninstalled, with no replacement driver/renderer installed.  Oh MS...how I love thee sometimes.

                   

                  Interesting, I'm familiar with the HP Universal, in fact it is one of my favorite Universals, I suppose it could be considered a redirected printer situation, but perhaps the issue extends beyond Citrix Universal drivers and into the HP ones and who knows what other vendors as well, it wouldn't shock me; because if the server( in this case print) security descriptor is invalid or not migrated, then the system doesn't have the SID/GUID for the printer server object (which the universals could be considered as), which just like in AD, if you don't have a SID or if it gets orphaned, your account/user/object for that SID just doesn't exist ( such as when you open a security window for an object and it just says Unknown Account/SID or ???-????-???? kind of jazz), which is why it is always a bad idea to mess with SIDs or GUIDs.  This happens such as when you erase an account from AD or the local user store that is a principal or owner of an object and you don't change that principal to another account before deleting the current principal, and you end up screwed out of access from it.

                   

                  Essentially that is what they did here by failing to migrate those keys and descriptors.  I could only imagine the horror for the IT person who has a sprawling 20 building campus serviced by Citrix Metaframe and Citrix Print services... I'd call out sick but that'd only last so long I suppose lol.

                   

                  Now time for my evening scotch and some youtube to lull me to sleep zzzz.....

                   

                  Hope all is back in order for you Mike, let me know what you find out!

                   

                  Spikeypup

              • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                elstaci

                This is the issue that SPIKEYPUP was mentioning about in the new Patch Tuesday update:

                Addressed issue where the ServerSecurityDescriptor registry value does not migrate when you upgrade to Windows 10 1703. As a result, users might not be able to add a printer using the Citrix Print Manager service. Additionally, they might not be able to print to a client redirected printer, a Citrix universal print driver, or a network printer driver using the Citrix universal print driver.

                 

                BTY, Thanks for reminding me about Patch Tuesday update. Forgot all about it ( Spikeypup).

                1 of 1 people found this helpful
                • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                  tigertiger

                  Latest version of Crimson also freeze on a CLEAN window Creator 1703 installation.

                  These drivers are getting buggy by the release

                  • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                    alleyviper

                    I confirm that there's something in the 17.10.1 package that deletes windows printers. It's not related to the last CU installation process (I'm on 15063.674).

                     

                    Unlike in the OP, in my system it's not related to driver installation, but Windows Printers are immediately deleted after running the 17.10.1 uninstaller. I've tried it two times with the same result.

                    17.9.3 isn't affected (tried it in the middle of 17.10.1 installations).

                      • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                        elstaci

                        I find really difficult to understand, how a Graphics driver, can delete or uninstall a printer from a computer. What relationship does a Graphic driver have with a printer driver in a computer?

                          • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                            alleyviper

                            Drivers don't need to have any kind of relation, problems can occur if there's a flaw in the uninstall script that points to something it shouldn't.

                            If I can delete all of my printers just by running the 17.10.1 uninstaller (but not with 17.9.3), something could be wrong with it or fixable, even if this mess up was introduced by the last CU.

                             

                            Some years ago, the standalone AMD Clean Uninstall Utility at some point had a bug that caused USB problems (even on non-AMD boards) after finishing its job. Things like that can (re)happen.

                            1 of 1 people found this helpful
                              • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                                spikeypup

                                amdmatt This is interesting news and thanks for all the testing and  information, have you reported this to AMD yet?  Since now it looks like there are more than a single report of this occurrence; there might be an issue. As you pointed out there could be an error in a GUID entry or VID within the .inf's or setup scripts causing the issue, or any number of things to be honest. 

                                 

                                If you haven't reported it, please do that as soon as possible so they are made aware, thanks! You can find a contact form here: Email Form

                                It also wouldn't hurt to report this issue here as well: http://www.amd.com/report

                                 

                                Be sure to include details such as your exact model of graphics card, PC, OS Ver/Build, and especially what make & model Printer(s) were affected, and whether your default MS PDF printer was removed as well.

                                 

                                Thanks for informing!

                                 

                                Spikeypup

                            • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                              amdmatt

                              Please can you provide a DXDIAG report so we can investigate? I will pass this feedback onto enginering, thanks guys.

                                • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                                  alleyviper

                                  Hi amdmatt, I've sent you a PM with a link to the DxDiag.txt file (under 16299.19 and latest Fall Update drivers, a combo that exhibits the problem). I've previously reported the issue with the web form.

                                  The new Beta Fall Update driver uninstaller also removes my printers (default MS Fax, Print to PDF, Microsoft XPS Printer, and Adobe PDF if present), both under current 16299.19 and previous 15063.674 W10.

                                  If there's any other driver install log file that could help to find this issue please tell me.

                                   

                                   

                                  I also have an unrelated problem to report related to 17.7.2 until 17.10.1 (all inclusive), they all cause issues on my MSI RX480 Gaming X when OC is applied either via Wattman or a reliable 3rd party tool like MSI AB (latest betas). If even a +1MHz OC is applied, when the card plays a video or similar non-3D loads that requires full clocks, voltage will be set constantly to 1.150-1.175V. Because this is a High ASIC card that runs only up to 1.043V under 3D stock (staying at ~1.032V under load), the GPU doesn't like it and ends up artifacting and then crashing the driver or BSOD with garbled screen on deskop/chrome/video use, even if it's stable on 3D (because the correct 1.043V will be used). For most regular ASIC card shouldn't have a problem, but for the few low voltage GPUs it hinders any sort of OC due to unexpectedly high values being applied under certain loads.

                                   

                                  The latest WDDM 2.3 drivers like the Fall Update don't suffer this, except if voltage is set to manual under Wattman. These latest drivers branch also have another small issue where applied memory clocks won't stay/show in the wattman respective slider that will always show default 2000, nor will they revert to default when resetting them. When I have time, I'll make a thread or report about it. Thanks!

                                  • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                                    alleyviper

                                    amdmatt Just to add, today I've disconnected the HDD drive and left only the SSD for a fresh W10 Fall Update install (from the final release ISO) to check if this could have to do with other drivers or software on my current Windows install that could have cause a registry problem.

                                     

                                    I've kept the PC off the internet, and after installing W10 to a clean drive and creating my profile, I've only installed the 17.10.2 drivers. All other devices remained with either default MS drivers, or driverless (like my wifi). After a reboot, I've uninstalled 17.10.2 via CP>Programs and Features,  AMD Software setup. Again, right after the driver was removed, the 3 present default windows printers were gone (Fax, Microsoft print to PDF, XPS Writer). After this I've restored the older SSD image.

                                     

                                    Could this be related to something in the way registry entries are created and devices enumerated on old AM3 boards? Again, 17.9.3 and previous drivers never had this problem.

                                      • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                                        amdmatt

                                        Please try a clean install of Windows 10 again, but this time connected to the internet so that the installer can download the latest updates. Once the installation has finished, please run Windows Update and install all of the available updates. At this stage you can then install the 17.10.2.

                                         

                                        Let me know how you get on.

                                          • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                                            alleyviper

                                            Hi amdmatt, I've only had time to do it now because it's a lengthy process having to recover the original SSD image after testing.

                                            I've done as you said. Let WU update everything after the first log in, do its restarts until nothing new is found and then install 17.10.2, reboot and uninstall them.

                                            Unfortunately the issue remains: right after the driver is uninstalled via the package setup (even before the bar reaches 100%, and right after the monitor blinks due to driver removal), the three default W10 printers are gone.

                                             

                                            It doesn't seem related with 16299.15 or 16299.19 (Latest CU that WU will install) or any extra software that I'm using. Looking back at my posts, the issue first appeared when I've tried 17.10.1 under 15063.674 before the 17th Fall Update, and it won't happen with drivers up to 17.9.3. It happens with the 17.10.1, Fall Update Beta and 17.10.2 uninstaller.

                                             

                                            It would be interesting to know if the OPs affected business machines's hardware.

                                              • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                                                amdmatt

                                                I've asked engineering to take a look at this.

                                                  • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                                                    alleyviper

                                                    I've just came across another machine where the same happens when removing 17.10.2 (also AM3 based, but with a more recent Asus M4A89GTD Pro + HD7870) under W10 16299.19. Unfortunately, I won't be able to any more testing on it because the aforementioned GPU is dying (sudden pink/gray screens with checkered artifacts under desktop/3d use) so I had to remove it from the PC. My ancient HD4890 had to go back (incompatible with current drivers). All printers (MS and the network HP printer) were removed after running the 17.10.2 uninstaller.

                                                     

                                                    Btw, for anyone that needs to restore the default Windows printers (Fax/PDF/XPS), just go to Control Panel, Programs and Features, "Turn Windows Features on or off". Find:

                                                    Microsoft Print to PDF

                                                    Microsoft XPS Document Writer (under 15063.xxx it'll be at the end of the list, with a different name starting with XPS')

                                                    Print and Document Services\Windows Fax and Scan

                                                     

                                                    Just unselect them, let windows reboot, and select them again so they'll be reinstalled.

                                                    • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                                                      barcuslaroche

                                                      Clean install of 17.10.3 deleted Razer Virtual Surround audio driver (and God knows what else) from my PC.

                                          • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                                            alleyviper

                                            Also, on the OP situation, even if the 17.10.1 drivers were never uninstalled, it could have been their setup that was used to clean the previous 17.9.3 (instead of 17.9.3's uninstaller that seems fine on my system). So it prematurely resulted in missing printers, as I can reproduce on my system via uninstall.

                                            • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                                              dadabhai

                                              Funny that I came across this post, because noticed just today ALL my printers were missing, my actual HP printer as well all the PDF, XPS, Fax, OneNote etc printer objects. At first I simply did a system restore to the last date I had, the 22nd, when a system restore was taken as I was installing AvP Classic 2000. After system restore, the printers were back. However, I had already updated to 17.10.2 when it was released, but then rolled back yesterday to 17.10.1 because GPU scaling is no longer working. On the 22nd, I would imagine I had the 17.10.1 installed. Overall very strange, but it might be a red herring and actually have something to do with MS patches instead. I don't know, either way a system restore fixed it for me.

                                              • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                                                therconjair

                                                Just had the same thing happen to me. Xerox printer on network and 17.10.3 driver package.

                                                 

                                                Additionally, Elgato Sound drivers were missing too, along with my Samsung C27HG70 main monitor.

                                                 

                                                https://community.amd.com/message/2831089#comment-2831089

                                                • Re: Latest AMD driver deletes all printers (17.10.1)!!
                                                  calebalexander

                                                  Last night I downloaded and installed Radeon-Pro-Software-17.Q4-Oct25 and that is exactly what happened to me. I did a clean install as usual. It removed ALL my printers. It not only removed my Brother printer, but also the printers for Adobe Acrobat, Snagit, Windows XPS printer just to name a few.

                                                   

                                                  It also deleted my scanner associated with the Brother printer.

                                                   

                                                  And for absolute certain, all those printers were there just prior to the install.

                                                   

                                                  I see that "This issue should now be resolved in Crimson 17.11.1 according to amdmatt. Great (sarcastic). So how do I get all my printers back? Never mind. I have a system image from a few days ago that I will use.

                                                   

                                                  Why is AMD still distributing Radeon-Pro-Software-17.Q4-Oct25 when the solution is in another release? This is very irresponsible.