PC Processors

[doughboi]

System

• Motherboard: MSI MPG X570 Gaming Pro Carbon WIFI
• CPU: Ryzen 7 3700X
• CPU Cooler(s): MSI MAG Coreliquid 360R AIO & Vetroo V5 Air Cooler
• GPU: EVGA GeForce RTX 2070 Super 8GB
• RAM: 32GB (2x16GB) Trident Z Neo DDR4-3600 CL16-16-16-36 1.35V - Model F4-3600C16D-32GTZN
• PSU: Corsair RM850x 80+ Gold
• Case: NZXT H700
• Operating System & Version: Windows 11 Pro - 21H2
• BIOS Version: 7B93v1H (latest release on 9/1/22)
• GPU Drivers: GeForce Game Ready Driver (2nd most recent update, not latest)
• CPU Drivers: 2.1.0.218 (latest release on 5/2/22)
• Chipset Drivers: AMD X570 Chipset Drivers Version 4.11.15.342 (latest release on 11/21/22)

Short Description of Issue:
I built my PC in mid-2019 and has ran completely fine till mid-2022. By fine I mean the temps were great compared to the alarming numbers Ryzen Master keeps showing me. The PC started producing very high temps across the board randomly a few months ago, on idle and load. It maxes out at the 95 °C thermal limit on almost every single game I tried to play and crashes in benchmarks. BIOS temp on boot starts around 47-50 °C and lands around 52-55 °C if left sitting on BIOS screen. This is in comparison to the last 3 years where BIOS temps never got above 35 °C. Benchmarking/gaming prior also never resulted in temps beyond 82-85 °C. I repasted my MSI 360R AIO 2 times. When that didn't help I replaced it with a decent air cooler a few weeks ago to see if my AIO was bad and I have repasted it on twice now too. Neither the AIO or air cooler seem to help the temperature issues I am experiencing. Both coolers are beyond overkill for the 65W TDP rating of the 3700x. I cannot get these temps to subside and it's beyond aggravating now. Nothing in my setup or environment changed since I built the PC.

Troubleshooting:
I updated BIOS, CPU, and AMD chipset drivers to the latest available. I know this tends to fix a lot of anomalies, however it didn't seem to help the temperature issue at all. After the BIOS update I did a CMOS reset and turned on the XMP profile for my RAM, setup my fan profiles, and turned PBO off. Everything else is at default setting. I'm currently running the Windows balanced power plan with min/max CPU usage set at 5%/99% respectfully. I stopped using the Ryzen balanced power plan in Windows 11. Neither plan made a difference in real-time temps though when troubleshooting. This got me thinking that the MSI 360 AIO had died (there is some distasteful findings across the web of this cooler failing way too prematurely < 1 year). I installed mine in mid-2020 and had no temp problems on my CPU till mid-2022. So, I found me a nice cheap air cooler with great reviews on Amazon, the Vetroo V5, and ordered that as a test (wraith prism had started leaking oil so I trashed it). It has 5 heat pipes and is rated as a 150W TDP cooler. I strictly use Noctua NT-H2 thermal paste. I sort of expected to see temps return to at minimum the nominal baseline I had seen for almost a year on the stock AMD Wraith Prism cooler from 2019-2020, but nope!

Unfortunately I don't have any other modern AM4 socket motherboards or other AMD series CPUs to test with.

[elstaci]

I would look at your MSI Mag Core Liquid CPU Cooler. MSI CPU Coolers have been having a lot of issues to the point the MSI issues a recall a while back: https://us.msi.com/Landing/liquid-cooler-swap-application

Dear MSI users,

Recently, we have received feedback from some of our users that they have experienced a drop in heat dissipation efficiency when using the MAG CORELIQUID 240R / MAG CORELIQUID 360R liquid coolers.

Our preliminary investigation has identified that a small portion of the liquid coolers produce sediment that can cause a blockage. This, however, will not cause any damage to your system since the processors are equipped with a protection mechanism against overheating.

MSI cares deeply about our users’ overall experience and we simplified our processes to provide faster product replacement services.

Users can identify whether they have an affected products by looking up the product serial number here. We will provide a comprehensive product replacement (MAG CORELIQUID 240R V2 / 360R V2) service to all affected products that have abnormal heat dissipation ( Example: CPU temperature is higher than 60°C while idle and the cooler is properly seated with thermal paste applied between the CPU and cooler ).

Make sure that your CPU Cooler is correctly installed and the water-block is making solid even contact with the surface of the processor.

The Radiator fan air flow is not obstructed or is spinning at full speed when overheating.

Check for blockages in the tubing and the Pump is working and rotating at its proper speed.

You can check if the pump is pumping by feeling the input tube to the water-block should be cooler than the output tube from the water-block.

EDIT: Sorry I didn't finish reading the entire original post. You are now using a 150 Watt Air CPU Cooler - Vetroo V5 and the CPU is still overheating?

I also have a 3700X and use a CoolerMaster Hyper212 EVO CPU Cooler rated at 150 watts. I needed to add a second fan ( High CFM Fan - 5000 rpm) to the CPU cooler to keep my 3700X temperatures below 72c under any type of loads.

The temperature fluctuates between 50c and 58c under normal use and at idle. Depending on my room temperature.

The only time I would start to worry about my CPU temperature is when it start running hotter than 70c all the time.

Make sure the Air CPU Cooler is making good solid even contact with the processor and you have good air circulation inside your PC case.

Observe the CPU Cooler fan and make sure it is running at maximum speed when it is getting hot. If the fan isn't turning try plugging the CPU Cooler fan in another Fan port and see if the fan starts to work normally.

Make sure all your case fans and filters are clean and working.

[doughboi]

From top down:

Your exact quotation was what led me down this path a few months ago. My MSI MAG 360R didn't qualify for the initial recall because I had got this AIO when it first hit the market. My SN was too "new". Long story short I got ahold of MSI and had a lengthy conversation with their tech support and explained to them what was going on with it. They confirmed that it is likely the cooler is bad and they approved an RMA for it. That's about 5-6 weeks without a cooler now.

This led me to buy the Vetroo V5 as 1) a test to see if the AIO was actually bad (Vetroo has TDP of 150W, MSI 360R has TDP of 105W) and 2) as a way to still keep my system up until I get my replacement AIO in from the RMA process with MSI.

Temps don't change when I take off my glass panel of the case and leave it open air flow. This tells me my fan configuration, which I haven't changed in 3 years is viable. I run a push/pull on the AIO with a rear and top exhaust. Right now I have placed 3 of the 6 fans from the AIO as intake into my case with the air cooler on the CPU, the way it was with the original stock cooler, but temps are drastically different now. I've repasted several times and each time I've done the X method AMD recommends for full die coverage without hotspots on Ryzen processors. Each time I've taken the coolers off the thermal compound is spread nice and evenly from the previous application.

I have not tried doing a push/pull configuration on the air cooler. Right now I just have 1 fan on there as a push. What is weird to me here is why would I need to add a 2nd fan for this higher rated tower cooler versus the stock Wraith Prism, which has a lesser TDP rating, when the Wraith Prism kept temps similar to that of what you're saying in your post when I first built the PC and ran it that way for over a year before going AIO. Now back to air cooled and slightly better temps (2-3 degrees at most) as I was seeing with my AIO.

[elstaci]

When I installed my Hyper212 with one fan it was adequate enough for my previous FX8350 125 watt TDP rated processor from keeping it from overheating or getting near its Maximum Operating temperature.

Then I upgraded to the Rzyen 3700x with a TDP rating of 65 watts and found out using one fan on the CPU Cooler wasn't sufficient enough to keep the processor from going over 85c under stress.

So I ordered a 5000 RPM Fan from Amazon and added it to the Hyper212 in a Push-Pull configuration. Since then my 3700x temperatures are below 60c under normal loads and under stress the highest it goes is 72c.

Ryzen processors seems to run much hotter than non-Ryzen processors due to the way they are manufactured from what I have read in the past.

It could be due to the way the CPU Cooler fan is attached to the Wraith Prism (Horizontally) rather than vertically on the other 3rd party CPU Coolers. just guessing though.

[misterj]

Thanks for all the information, doughboi! If more users would post like you it sure would make it easier. I do not believe that your MSI cooler was rated 105 Watt while MSI says it supports 3990X with a TDP of 280 Watts. I think it is the reason why things went so well before. With 3x120mm fans, it should be more than enough if the fans and pump are good. I have a 3970X also with TDP of 280 Watts and when the pump is not gummed up it does just fine with 2x120mm fans. I recommend you wait till your MSI cooler comes home (when?). Where did you see the 105 Watt TDP? MSI does not post a TDP. I always run my pump and all my fans on 12 Volts. Can you try that? Thanks and enjoy, John.

[misterj]

doughboi, what cooler are you running now? What do you mean by "...alarming numbers Ryzen Master keeps showing..."? Ryzen Master (RM) is correct and most of the free ones are wrong. Please post SSs of RM both Basic and Advanced views running Cinebench R23, ONLY RM images. I agree with your original diagnosis. I had a AIO get gummy inside and I had to RMA when my system shut down. Do not know why you went to Air. Thanks and enjoy, John.

[doughboi]

In my OP I'm running the Vetroo V5 right now:

"I repasted my MSI 360R AIO 2 times. When that didn't help I replaced it with a decent air cooler a few weeks ago to see if my AIO was bad and I have repasted it on twice now too. Neither the AIO or air cooler seem to help the temperature issues I am experiencing."

I only do temperature reading verifications on Ryzen Master so all the analytical data spoken in my OP was done so while using RM.

I can tell you now what RM would show if I ran Cinebench R23, 95. Under heavy load (gaming or benchmarking) I'm always hitting the 95 degree thermal limit. Last time I ran the benchmark it failed because the CPU couldn't finish the segments without throwing an error due to the heat.

I'm still baffled though at how the new working air cooler isn't producing better temps than the (assumed) dead MSI AIO when it has a higher TDP rating overall.

[wim-bart]

A 360mm radiator with a good pump can even keep an 5950X cool at idle with zero RPM fans. You write you tried an air cooler also and even that is not keeping it all cool.

This wonders if there is something wrong with the CPU itself, that it is reporting wrong temperature, what can be the case, or something is wrong with the motherboard. Maybe the voltages are to high for example causing quick overheating. It can be the case that the BIOS is having a to high voltage for the CPU what causes heating when CPU starts to boost. Try to set VCore in the BIOS to a value between 1.25 and 1.3V and see what happens with the temperatures during load. Some BIOSes just set the wrong voltage by accident. A 3700X should not be set above 1.350 (although until 1.4 is still safe). But first try a relative low value and work up from that. A 3700X can easy be cooled with a 360 AIO and I even wonder if the RAD even needs fans because it is so overdimensioned. 

[misterj]

doughboi, until I see screenshots of RM I can not even speculate what the problem might be. Please post the mages I requested! Enjoy, John.

[Eric_B]

Same issue here. 

At first I thought it was malware, so I did a fresh install of Windows 11. I always had high temperatures at rest, and more than 90°C in games! I installed Windows 10 and it was the same. With an improvement of the temperature at rest with Windows 10.
BIOS correctly configured without overclocking.
I will give here my configuration:
ASROCK Taichi Razer Edition x570 BIOS 1.90
AMD 5950x revision : VMR-B0
Custom Watercooling System Corsair XD7 @4800rpm

I also re-flash the BIOS with the BIOSFLASHBACK button technique behind the PC... I thought I had a malware in the BIOS !

[Eric_B]

Same issue here. 

At first I thought it was malware, so I did a fresh install of Windows 11. I always had high temperatures at rest, and more than 90°C in games! I installed Windows 10 and it was the same. With an improvement of the temperature at rest with Windows 10.
BIOS correctly configured without overclocking.
I will give here my configuration:
ASROCK Taichi Razer Edition x570 BIOS 1.90
AMD 5950x revision : VMR-B0
Custom Watercooling System Corsair XD7 @4800rpm


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