PC Processors

[tlee58657]

I damaged an Asus M5A87 mobo in my homebuilt desktop, which was running an FX-6300.  I installed the FX-6300 on the replacement mobo, and it would not POST or boot.  I installed an AMD Athlon II x2 245 instead, and successfully booted w/ the replacement mobo into Windows 10, and updated the BIOS to latest version, to ensure it would support an FX-6300 or FX-8300.  But when I tried the FX-6300 in the replacment mobo, it would not POST or boot.  I tried an FX-8300, which was brand new, but had been sitting on a shelf for a couple of years, and the replacement mobo still would not POST or boot. 

Asus tech support is suggesting that I contact you at AMD to see if there is some way to test and see if the FX-8300 and/or the FX-6300 are working and functional.  Can I send them to you for testing?  Please advise. 

[misterj]

tlee58657, this is a User Forum, not AMD.  I suggest you contact AMD Online Support.  Enjoy, John.

[tlee58657]

OK, thank you, will do. 

[elstaci]

If your Processors are less then three years old you can open a AMD WARRANTY REQUEST from here: AMD Warranty Request Form | AMD 

They can tell you how to check if the processor is defective and whether it is under Warranty.

NOTE: Make sure your Motherboard has BIOS version 1301 installed for the FX processors to be recognized and supported. That is if you replaced it the motherboard with the same original one you had before.

[tlee58657]

I have an FX-6300 that is more than 3 yrs. old (purchased 5/2013), and an FX-8300 that is just over 3 yrs. old (purchased 3//2016).  I had to use a dual-core, AMD Athlon II x2 245 to update the mobo's BIOS to v. 1506.  But neither the FX-6300 or FX-8300 works in the new, exact replacement, mobo.  The new mobo will not POST or boot, whereas it does with the dual-core.  The FX-6300 did work in the original, now-damaged, mobo.  ASUS tech support is saying the FX-8300 could be bad, even though it's been sitting on a shelf since I bought it. 

[elstaci]

does indicate that both, which is rare, are both defective.

Best way to check is to try and install it on another compatible Motherboard. If both don't boot up nor  POST on another compatible Motherboard with the correct version of BIOS installed then you have bad processors.

Check both FX processor visually for any bent or missing pins or physical damage. Might want to use a magnifying glass to help.

Possibly the bad motherboard shorted out the FX-6300.  As for the FX-8300 I personally doubt it went bad by just sitting on a shelf for over three years unless you received it defective from the Retailer or was physically damaged while on the shelf.

I have a FX-8350 which has been excellent with a Asus Sabertooth 990FX Motherboard. Even after the Processor overheated more than once (due to a defective CPU Cooler) and shut down the computer. It stills works like a new Processor.

[tlee58657]

Neither the FX-6300 or FX-8300 have bent pins.  I checked with magnifying glasses.  The last I checked, the original mobo ran the FX-6300, but the physical damage (to a SATA port) may have caused operating system (Win10) errors and blue screens.  I could try it again, but wanted to see if I could have AMD check the processors, as ASUS tech support suggested.  I'll see if I can test both processors in the original mobo. 

[elstaci]

AMD probably would have checked them (RMA) if they were within the 3 year Warranty period.

Installing the processor on the bad Motherboard is not going to produce different results since both motherboards are the same Make & Model. If the processors are bad and then I see no harm in installing it in the defective motherboard. At least to see if it boots up regardless if it BSODs while entering Windows.

I would take the Processors to a computer repair shop or Best Buy to check the processors out. But it probably might cost almost as much as a new processor to have them check it out.

This give some Troubleshooting tip on how to tell if the Processor is bad or not: How to Figure Out if My Processor Is Damaged | Chron.com and this article from same tech gives symptoms of bad processor: How Can I Tell if My CPU Is Bad? | Chron.com 

One tip it mentions is a good one which I forgot to mention.

With the bad processor installed, how many BEEPS to you hear when you power up and it starts to Boot?

[tlee58657]

Thanks, elstaci.  I hesitate to go to the trouble of running the FX-6300 in the original, damaged mobo again, because it successfully booted into Windows 10 last time.  There are no BIOS beeps on boot.  But a blue screen occurs after approximately 13 minutes of idle time.  It takes longer, if the computer is doing a task, and then, I do eventually get a blue screen.  I've been trying to troubleshoot the problem for almost a year, in Microsoft forums. 

Damage to the original mobo appeared at first to be minor enough not to require replacing.  About two years ago, a mobo SATA connector became partially disconnected and dislodged from the mobo surface when I bumped it (the SATA cable was in the SATA connector) during removal of the HDD.  However, the computer ran OK for a year or so after that.  Then, last June, the computer started giving blue screens after the 13 minutes of idle time.  After extensive troubleshooting for months, I decided to try a mobo replacement.  This cost me quite a bit because the only available, exact replacement was from Germany by way of eBay, and shipping added significantly, with the resulting total cost of over $150.  

The replacement mobo would not boot with the FX-6300, though.  The seller told me to make sure the BIOS was updated sufficiently to run the FX-6300, and also did send me a 2nd replacement mobo at no extra charge.  I then had to purchase the dual core to update the BIOS on the 1st replacement mobo, after which the FX-6300 and FX-8300 would not even POST.  No beeps at all, with just a blank screen indicating no signal.  But it runs and boots fine with the dual-core.  This is where things stand now. 

ASUS tech support is concluding it must be the FX-8300 that isn't working, and told me to purchase a new one.  I said, I don't think so, for reasons I've been describing.  That's when they suggested asking AMD to test the FX-8300.  

I am hesitant to run the FX-8300 in the original, damaged mobo, in case that mobo did something to the FX-6300 which made it incapable of running in the 1st replacement mobo.  I'm concerned the original mobo might possibly, similarly damage the FX-8300 if I used it to test.  

I could try the 2nd replacement mobo, by first using the dual core again to update the BIOS, and then trying the FX-6300 and FX-8300 in that.  But if the process of updating the BIOS with the dual core somehow rendered the 1st replacement mobo incapable of running the FX-6300 and FX-8300, I don't want to also do the same damage to the 2nd replacement mobo. 

That's why I'm considering asking AMD to test the FX-6300 and FX-8300.  It would be an independent test.  I could also ask a computer repair shop or Best Buy, as you suggest.  But if it's going to cost alot, maybe I should just purchase another CPU.  I've already purchased a replacement power supply and video card, during the process of troubleshooting. 

I wrote this without reading your reference links, but will read them now. 

[elstaci]

I had the same sentiment about installing the FX's in the defective MoBo. It could damage the FX's (if they are good) if the MoBo is shorting out. That is why I said if the processors were BAD then you can install it on the defective MoBo to see if it boots up.

If the new Mobo BIOS hasn't been updated to at least 1301, the FX won't boot up because the current BIOS (if older than 1301) will not recognize the FX processors. I see the last BIOS version is 1506.

You have a very old Mobo. Only Windows 8.1 and below has drivers but not for Windows 10. But that should not matter, the computer should still POST and Boot up.

Make sure the CPU Cooler is installed correctly and you don't apply too much Thermal Paste on the CPU and the CPU Fan is running during power up.

According to the above article (second link) which I showed the entire article, one of the symptoms of a bad Processor is BSODs.

First: make sure you have the latest BIOS version installed (1506).

Second: make sure you install the CPU Cooler correctly and it is running during power up.

Third: Make sure you have all the Mobo Power connectors connected including any 4 or 8 pin Aux Power Connectors.

Fourth: Cross your fingers.

EDIT: I don't believe AMD will check your processors since they are out-of-Warranty.

For $150 dollars you could have purchased a much newer and better MoBo like Asus Sabertooth 990FX Mobo which runs the same CPUs as yours. Most likely you could have used the same DDR3 RAM memory. But that is water under the bridge since you already purchased the same Mobo as before.

[tlee58657]

I ended up purchasing a new, FX-8350 processor, as the FX-6300 and FX-8300 were out of warranty and so AMD would not test them.  The computer has booted up successfully a number of times now, and is up, running and stable.  Thanks to all for your help and suggestions.  

[elstaci]

The FX8350 is an excellent Processor for the money. I have the same processor on my computer. Very hardy.

Just make sure you have a very good CPU Cooler since the FX8350 is a rather high wattage Processor (TDP 125 Watts).

[tlee58657]

I used to have a good, third-party air cooler, with the FX-6300.  But with the FX-8350, I installed the stock cooler that came with the processor in the box, because the 3-year AMD warranty says you have to use the supplied cooler in order for the warranty to be valid if the processor needs to be returned. 

But on some of the many hot days at the end of July here in Boston, I found that, with the stock cooler, inside the closed case, even with many case-cooling fans, the screen and computer locked up from what I'm pretty sure was overheating.  The room was not air-conditioned.  If it was, this might not have happened.  When I took off the case side panel and aimed a regular fan to blow inside the case, the computer resumed worked normally without the screen locking up. 

It's cooler at this time, 78, down from 95, ambient temperature, but I'm going to continue with the regular fan blowing into the open case for awhile to see how it goes.  But I'm thinking this might only be a problem on these hot, summer days. 

[elstaci]

You can use a 3rd party CPU Cooler as long as it has the same or better requirements as the AMD CPU Cooler. AMD won't void your Warranty.

I installed a Cooler Master Hyper-212 EVO for around $35.00 dollars after my very old stock CPU Cooler (Non-AMD) went bad. It keeps my FX8350 below or at 60C under severe loads and stress.  The Maximum Operating Temperature of the FX 8350 is 61C. Once it reaches or goes above 61C the CPU will start to throttle to lower the temperature back below 61c. If it can't it will shut down the computer to prevent damage to the CPU and surrounding hardware.

But in your case, if your room temperature is in the 90's F it will be extremely difficult for any CPU Cooler to keep the CPU cool since it is circulating hot air inside the computer case. Putting a external fan blowing air inside your case is probably the best way to maintain your CPU from overheating.

[dacq]

What case is it? The Cooler Master h500 is a case with very good air flow. If you get it then you can also aim your fan at it.

If the stock fan looks a little used then you can swap it for a better one.

[tlee58657]

The case is a Thermaltake V3 (black).  It has good airflow, but I installed the stock cooler that came with the FX-8350, instead of the Cooler Master Hyper T4 - CPU Cooler that I had used with the FX-6300.  I am/was afraid the AMD warranty would not be honored if I ever had to return it, and did not use their cooler as the CPU package insert specified. 

The screen then locked up on one of these very hot days, in an unairconditioned room.  Only because my partner got on my case about the room seeming too stuffy (the windows were all open) did I put a fan in the window, open up the side panel on the computer case and aim a regular fan towards the inside.   

There is a saying for Marines in training that they will take better care of their rifle/weapon than they take care of themselves.  That is true for me.  In this case, I didn't care about me; but for the computer, I improved the air circulation. 

[tlee58657]

Correction:  the after-market cooler I had was the Cooler Master Hyper TX3, not the Hyper T4. 

[dacq]

You should keep the case closed otherwise the fans inside won't be able to cool. Then aim outside fans at the PC.

youtu.be/a12aDCxrcts shows how to improve airflow.

[tlee58657]

I will watch the videos, but I have read discussions about case cooling, air flow, and fans before, in the past.  

For the third time since I installed the FX-8350, the computer screen has locked up, and I've had to manually power the computer off.  Since this happened, for the past several hours, I've tried to boot three times, unsuccessfully; the mobo will not POST.  I would be alarmed except that this has happened twice before, and each time, I had to wait days before the PC would POST and boot again into Windows.  

This third time, I had put the side panel back on, with the ambient, room temperature at 80 F, and it locked up after about 4 hours.  I was away, and so don't know exactly how long it was.  Prior to this, the computer was running fine with no problems for a couple of days, with the side panel off and the fan blowing into the case.  

I did an online search for "fx 8350 locks up screen" and found this problem occurs for other folks, whether with the stock cooler or good aftermarket coolers.  Some folks get blue screens, too, but not me.   

I'm going to wait a couple of days or longer, and try to boot again, this time with the outside fan blowing into the case with the side panel off again. 

The first time this happened, I thought the processor was bad, but others in the search results said they thought the same thing, and that no, it's not necessarily bad.  And also, I was able to boot successfully into Windows, eventually, twice before.  

[elstaci]

Read this link from a Tech site on what causes computers to freeze: Causes of Computer Freeze Ups | Chron.com 

1-It mentions not enough RAM or faulty RAM

2-Malicious malware

3-Overheating of CPU or GPU

4- Sofware conflicts like drivers

5-Faulty hardware like a bad Hard drive with bad sectors or a faulty PSU that isn't giving enough power thus causing the freezes.

At least you have some method of troubleshooting your computer freezes.

[tlee58657]

OK, thanks!  I wanted to ask you, how do you know AMD will not void the warranty if you don't specifically use their stock cooler?  Just asking, because that's what it says on the package insert, that the stock cooler must be used.  Because I might try re-using the Cooler Master Hyper TX3.  

[elstaci]

Good question, There is some confusion from AMD WARRANTY FAQ and AMD PROCESSOR-IN-A-BOX Statement.

From AMD Processor in a box statement Warranty concerning Heatsinks/Fans: AMD Processor in a box (PIB) 3 Year Limited Warranty | AMD 

According to the above statement as long as the Heatsink/Fan supports operation of the AMD Processor and is in conformance with AMD Specs it will be covered by AMD Warranty. 

If you use a CPU Cooler that is too weak to maintain the CPU Temperature and the processor is damaged, then the Warranty will be voided. Another words if your CPU Cooler which is made for a processor of TDP of 65 Watts but use it on a processor with a TDP of 125 Watts then the warranty will most likely be voided since you used an under powered CPU Cooler.

Found this at Cooler Master Support. Seems like your TX3 is compatible with processors with TDP of 95 Watts or less : https://landing.coolermaster.com/pages/tdp-and-socket-compatibility/  Which means I wouldn't install your Cooler Master because it wouldn't cool a FX8350 with a TDP of 125 Watts.

I have a Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO which is compatible with my FX8350 TDP of  125 Watts since the Hyper 212 EVO is made for processors with TDP of 150 Watts or less.

Now AMD WARRANTY FAQ says something different and more strict to the above statement: AMD Processor Warranty Coverage and Eligibility - Frequently Asked Questions (FAQs) 

I tend to believe, in my opinion, the PIB statement as being true. AMD has an official website that recommends 3rd Party CPU Coolers for their AMD ThreadRipper Processors. Nowhere does it mention the Warranty will be voided. Here is the Website: Thermal Solutions for Ryzen™ Threadripper™ Processors | AMD 

EDIT: The reason why AMD recommends 3rd party CPU Coolers for the Ryzen ThreadRippers is because they don't come bundled with a CPU Cooler

Here are all the AMD Processors in a box that comes bundled with a CPU Cooler: Processor Cooling Thermal Solutions | CPU Coolers | AMD 

If I were you I would open a AMD Warranty Request and ask them if your Cooler Master will void the Warranty.  Personally I would continue using AMD CPU Cooler unless you get a stronger CPU Cooler compatible to the Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO type of CPU Cooler for processors with TDP of 150 Watts or less.

Open a AMD Warranty Request from here: AMD Warranty Request Form | AMD 

[tlee58657]

Thanks for your help and AMD links about processors and coolers.  Also, I wouldn't have thought of looking for cooler and processor support chart from Coolermaster.  For now, I'll take your advice and stick with the stock processor.  I've heard of the Hyper 212, and might purchase it and give it a try. 

I have found this:  "There is also the added factor of the luck of the draw - two processors that have the same name can potentially vary wildly in power consumption."

https://www.anandtech.com/show/13945/the-amd-ryzen-5-2500x-and-ryzen-3-2300x-cpu-review/19

The Asus website for my mobo, M5A87, says that all versions of the board support the FX-8350, as of BIOS version 1301 and higher.  I am running version 1506, the latest version. 

https://www.asus.com/us/supportonly/M5A87/HelpDesk_CPU/

The computer is not a gaming PC, but used for browsing and a variety of programs, none of which are terribly cpu-intensive (no video editing, watching movies, etc.).  It does have a low-to-midrange video card. 

There are also a number of CPU and other settings that can be changed, it seems, in the BIOS and elsewhere.  I might experiment with some of those the next time the computer is up and running.  Some of these are described in the following links.

https://forums.tomshardware.com/threads/amd-fx-8350-freezing-computer.2119044/

AMD turbo boost was causing this poster's freezing.  Turned feature off in BIOS and hasn't frozen in 12 hours.

https://community.amd.com/thread/190321

FX-8350 RANDOM BSOD LOCKUPS
"In both setups tried to disable: turbo core, cool and quiet c6, same bsods and lockups.
The only way to get the system stable was to underclock using AMD Catalyst control center down to 3400Mhz."

jkphoenix
 
@ amdmatt on Oct 21, 2015 11:59 AM
"Ok matt, I set the lowest stable voltage
 
               so i set the CPU VID at 1.3875 V
               and because i love the turbo core feature i turn it on at 4200MHz and VID at 1.4125 V
         
               second day the system is solid and responds very well
 
               the temperatures are good."
 

https://community.amd.com/thread/218376

"I tried many solutions, like disable cool n quiet, disable c1e, disable c6, disable power management etc. no help.
I also tried manually set CPU speed at 200 x 20, with VID 1.35 - 1.375 - 1.4, no help."

There are more tweaks, but you get the idea.

[tlee58657]

An update.  I ended up buying the Hyper 212 EVO, and returning and exchanging the problematic FX-8350 for another.  The computer has been running fine for about 4-5 days now, with no signs of problems.  Thanks for the advice on the Hyper 212 - it's a good cooler.