PC Processors

mickyfin · ‎11-19-2020

I have paired a new Ryzen 9 5950x with an Asus Crosshair viii hero, but I am suffering really high temperatures. at idle the processor is running at 75C. Under very light load goes up to 80C

I have tried lot of things and just for clarity I am very experienced in building machines (over 25 years).

I used a Corsair 100i platinum cooler and after several attempts to cool ( 4 reseats using 3 different CPU thermal pastes) I came initially to the conclusion it was the cooler at fault.

Wanting to use I bit the bullet and bought a replacement cooler a Kraken X73, I installed and net result was 1C cooler i.e. 74C. So not the cooler but something else!

I did some searching online to discover others have been having a similar issue multiple motherboards, I found some suggestions to help which were to switch my board into an eco mode (which did nothing) the next suggestion was to disable boosting (which kind of cripples the chip) , this I did and now see temperatures in the region of 45C. I don't know where the problem lies exactly, but if several manufactures are seeing then it kind of points to an AMD issue with the Chip or something they have supplied to the board manufacturers. After days of building and then re-applying the coolers I do feel a little cheated. I tried raising with ASUS but because I registered my motherboard for cash back it is saying the serial number is already registered so cannot raise a support case. I coming on here hoping that someone can give some advice and maybe someone from AMD can help.

astrosquirrel · ‎01-05-2021

Yo guys, there's a veriable I haven't seen mentioned much in here. Lighting.

In my system, I've synched 4 items in Amoury Crate:

ROG Hero Mobo

ROG Scope Keyboard

GSKill Memory

Aourus Graphics card

The effect I've chosen is "Starry night". This keeps the lighting service nice and busy at about 4-5% CPU Consumption. Here are some screens when I've chosen the static light at a dark colour vs the starry night effect.... Guess which is which (both idle temps) ;)

Ero_Sennin · ‎01-05-2021

With the settings I mentioned before in my posts here, I am getting these temps when using Vegas Pro. I am sure it will be higher later. Imagine if the frequency was at 4.9GHz now with auto boost, how much more temps I could have? Because now it's in 4.1GHz for all cores. Or am I wrong? I selected only the CPU for rendering while I still waiting my new GPU and my current is just a GTX 970 G1 Gaming. And I still waiting my AIO liquid cooler. This is with CoolerMaster 212 RGB black edition.

astrosquirrel · ‎01-05-2021

@Ero_Sennin wrote:
With the settings I mentioned before in my posts here, I am getting these temps when using Vegas Pro. I am sure it will be higher later. Imagine if the frequency was at 4.9GHz now with auto boost, how much more temps I could have? Because now it's in 4.1GHz for all cores. Or am I wrong? I selected only the CPU for rendering while I still waiting my new GPU and my current is just a GTX 970 G1 Gaming. And I still waiting my AIO liquid cooler. This is with CoolerMaster 212 RGB black edition.

I guess that would depend largely on your voltage at the time. If I'm not mistaken on your image, it's hovering around the 1.14 volts.

On my end, at 4.6 - 4.9GHz at 1.48/9 volts, it can get to around 80-85. Never seen it past the 85 degree mark.... but that's because it clocks down to 4.6

Ero_Sennin · ‎01-05-2021

Well if you get max 85 degrees with 4.6-4.9GHz, it's good enough if you ask me. In the photo you saw above I have voltages settings in Auto. I just used the TPU 2 settings from the BIOS. Did you change the vcore to 1.48 and just the CPU frequency or something else too?

giboune · ‎01-05-2021

Just to tell you.

I disable PBO (for sure) and CPB.

And if I enable CPB (without PBO), I have frame dropping in my games.

Ero_Sennin · ‎01-05-2021

@giboune

These settings are disabled as well from my end. Sad to hear about the frame drop. Wondering when we ll be finally available to use this CPU to its max potential 😔

astrosquirrel · ‎01-05-2021

@Ero_Sennin wrote:
Well if you get max 85 degrees with 4.6-4.9GHz, it's good enough if you ask me. In the photo you saw above I have voltages settings in Auto. I just used the TPU 2 settings from the BIOS. Did you change the vcore to 1.48 and just the CPU frequency or something else too?

1.48/9 is about the max voltage that the board is throwing at it with CPB and PBO enabled. Doesn't mean it's always there. It can go down to 1.25 but never seen it lower than 1.24 so far.

I agree with the statement that this is good enough. I'm happy with that and going by what AMD are saying, we should all be. I even dialled back my fan curves now.

Looking at the information from AMD, I fall right bang on on what their guidance is.

Dynaverse · ‎01-05-2021

So far I disabled PBO from the motherboard bios and it helped lower everything by around 5c. I also ripped off my old air cooler which was more than fine to cool my 3950x and replaced with a Kraken X63. Now its running 70c in windows and about 80c in gaming. Still too hot. Looking for solutions to bring it down a little more. For some reason the boost clock pushes this thing to around 4.9 Ghz when it can, it's way too hot lol. I'll fiddle with it some more. Had I known it would be this much tinkering I would've just overclocked my 3950x and forgot about the 5950x honestly.

How many years can a chip last running at these temperatures? I doubt it will go over 3 years.

Chibi28 · ‎01-06-2021

@astrosquirrel wrote:
@Ero_Sennin wrote:
With the settings I mentioned before in my posts here, I am getting these temps when using Vegas Pro. I am sure it will be higher later. Imagine if the frequency was at 4.9GHz now with auto boost, how much more temps I could have? Because now it's in 4.1GHz for all cores. Or am I wrong? I selected only the CPU for rendering while I still waiting my new GPU and my current is just a GTX 970 G1 Gaming. And I still waiting my AIO liquid cooler. This is with CoolerMaster 212 RGB black edition.

I guess that would depend largely on your voltage at the time. If I'm not mistaken on your image, it's hovering around the 1.14 volts.

On my end, at 4.6 - 4.9GHz at 1.48/9 volts, it can get to around 80-85. Never seen it past the 85 degree mark.... but that's because it clocks down to 4.6

I wonder why its throttling when AMD says 90-95C is normal.

Ero_Sennin · ‎01-06-2021

@Chibi28

Well, when the friend above mentioned that he got frame drops, I guess this is not smooth or normal or a stable behavior for a CPU that costs 900€. And I don't think he is using a low level GPU.

astrosquirrel · ‎01-06-2021

I wouldn't say it's throttling. Perhaps I didn't explain myself properly. It goes up and down between 4.6 and 4.9, which is the expected behaviour as that's the boost clock for single core and not the base all core clock :).

giboune · ‎01-06-2021

Hello,

I would like to retry to use PBO... to see the difference.

But when I turn it enable the frequency remain stable at 4000MHz, on TPU1.

How can I retry with PBO ?

Thank.

Ero_Sennin · ‎01-06-2021

@giboune

I think you need to change the setting of TPU 1 to Kee Current Settings and then enable PBO and CPB, restart and try again.

giboune · ‎01-06-2021

I can't have a variable frequency like in stock with PBO.

I really replace every options like before change, but it's 3400, 3600, 4000MHz stable, depends CPU core ratio 34, 36, 40...

With PBO and CPB enable, but frenquency still stable.

Can you return at stock ?

Ero_Sennin · ‎01-06-2021

@giboune

In this case, I would save your current profile BIOS settings in the values you had it as a safe option to avoid the high temps and then I would use the option Load Optimized Defaults and reboot the PC. Then I would enter instantly again BIOS and change only the RAM speed to the max they support. The rest should be fine and work with auto boost.

Dynaverse · ‎01-07-2021

So I finally controlled the temps. What really helped is using Ryzen Master making sure PBO is ENABLED, and then going to Creator Mode and setting it to ECO. It clocks down to about 4.5 Ghz, but runs everything cool, from 60 - 70c, which I'm very happy with. I'm using a new Kraken X63 to control thermals, my old air cooler couldn't do it. I also updated my drivers for my Asus X570-E and my AMD chipset, nothing helped. Honestly If I had known this chip would load around 86c - 88c at 4.9 Ghz, I would've just stuck to my 3950x and clocked it to 4.3 and forgot about it. New buyers might want to keep this in mind, the 5950x does require an actual water cooler, a good one, and even then it depends on your climate and ambient room temperatures for perfect thermal results. I called AMD and they didn't seem too worried about these temperatures, their response was that "it has 16 cores as long as it runs under 90c it's normal". I mean my car oil temperature runs at 90c, that's a lot, too much even.

astrosquirrel · ‎01-07-2021

@Dynaverse wrote:
So I finally controlled the temps. What really helped is using Ryzen Master making sure PBO is ENABLED, and then going to Creator Mode and setting it to ECO. It clocks down to about 4.5 Ghz, but runs everything cool, from 60 - 70c, which I'm very happy with. I'm using a new Kraken X63 to control thermals, my old air cooler couldn't do it. I also updated my drivers for my Asus X570-E and my AMD chipset, nothing helped. Honestly If I had known this chip would load around 86c - 88c at 4.9 Ghz, I would've just stuck to my 3950x and clocked it to 4.3 and forgot about it. New buyers might want to keep this in mind, the 5950x does require an actual water cooler, a good one, and even then it depends on your climate and ambient room temperatures for perfect thermal results. I called AMD and they didn't seem too worried about these temperatures, their response was that "it has 16 cores as long as it runs under 90c it's normal". I mean my car oil temperature runs at 90c, that's a lot, too much even.

I respectfully disagree. The only thing that's happening here is that expectations and reality aren't aligning. For starters, the 5950x is a massive improvement to the 3950x and that's an objective fact:

~~https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72AHENDeTEI~~

~~Maybe what you want to say is that the upgrade is that the improvement was little for your use case, in which case ... :-/ yeah that's unfortunate :(~~

EDIT: Ah I see you edited your post. I was replying to your previous statement about it being little improvement.

Regarding the water cooler bit, I would say that's also not fully accurate. You will need a top of the line air cooler or an AIO onwards. But then again, this is a top of the line CPU. Coming back to your car analogy, you wouldn't cool a race car with a twingo radiator ...right? :)

Ero_Sennin · ‎01-08-2021

Hi again friends,

@astrosquirrel
@mickyfin
@Dynaverse
@giboune
@Chibi28

I didn't find anyone else in the tagging list. So, sorry if I forgot someone.

It seems there is a new BIOS beta update for the Asus Rog Strix X570-E Gaming that I flashed today. It updates the AGESA mode and it mentioning a new CPU support in the changelog.

The settings I did in BIOS is to leave PBO and CPB enabled. I have changed performance enhancer from Auto to default. I also used the Ryzen DRAM Calculator to get the values I need for a fast profile for my RAM performance and I changed the timings and the voltages values to what Ryzen DRAM Calculator gave me. So I actually now run my RAM at its best timings at 3600MHz that is their max frequency support.

I also used the Quick Fan Control on BIOS by pressing F6 to set all my fans from CPU and the PC Case to maximum speed.

Then I checked the services in Windows and while I am not using any Asus software like Aura or Armoury Crate etc. I noticed that there were some Asus services running on the background. So I disabled them all from auto start.

Everything else in BIOS is set in Auto like from scratch.

Now in idle mode I get these temps while when I opened Chrome with its tabs for first time and the monitoring software for the temps, it reached 70 degrees:

I tried to use Bench CPU and Stress CPU on CPU-Z but it seems it doesn't use the max frequency of the CPU to have an absolute image of the temps while CPU is full loaded. So I tried the CPU mark performance test that making a lot of tests for the CPU and the highest temperature it reached was 78 degrees Celsius as you can see in the photo:

It seems if I am not wrong that these results are better than before regarding the temps. Before it was going more than 80 in my case. About 84-87. And keep in mind that I am still using an air coolermaster cooler that is recommended for the 5800x and not 5950x. I am still waiting as I mentioned before my CoolerMaster ML360R AIO.

Anyway. I hope this helps somehow guys.

demogorg · ‎01-04-2021

well you obviously havnt read a single aritcle in the thread! Its not the Problem that the cpu gets hot under high loads but running crome on windows with a cooling that can run 2 5950x shouldnt get the cpu anywhere near the maximum temperatures!

Back 2 Topic I changed the Vcore to 1,2 and not to auto which resulted in significantly lower temperatures and the spikes are nearly gone. I suppose in terms of the internal overclocking it will also cost a little performance but it seems to help a bit

erdoc2 · ‎01-04-2021

I have found it is either voltage spikes from the PBO attempting to overclock or a program running in the background that is using CPU resources and increasing temps. The 5950 seems to be very sensitive to even small voltage changes.

AlienLoRd · ‎01-04-2021

Even after disabling the Gamerfirst service,.. and removing the program...

The idle temp went down from 75c - around 45c - 55c

However I am still frustrated,... this is my first AMD CPU and under heavy load I saw 93c yesterday!

Why is there no default operation mode for this CPU... to work cool and boost within reason!

I am not familiar with all the AMD things in the Bios... and All my previous Intel CPUs all that I had to do is to load optimized defaults and everything worked fine...

Is this an Asus issue? Is this an AMD issue? pfff....

My Specs:

5950x

Asus Rog X570 E-Gaming

Kraken Z73 360

32GB @ 3600 (The profile option thing...).

RTX 3080

Samsung 980 Pro...

erdoc2 · ‎01-04-2021

I believe that AMD is more prone to the temps and the 5000 series seem to be more so than the 3000 series. I had a 3900x and it ran warm as well but not as warm as my 5950. I just saw a video today that said the temp we’re seeing is at the hottest part of the die and that area can actually even hit 110 before it begins to throttle. I haven’t tested it yet and don’t really want to.
I think the 5000 series is still a work in progress for the MB manufacturers. With BIOS upgrades I think things will improve.

AlienLoRd · ‎01-04-2021

Ok... just tried one more thing and it seems to be too good to be true...

1. I have completely removed ASUS AI Suite.

2. Restarted the PC.

3. Loaded optimized defaults in Bios and Ram profile.

Now Idle at 38c, and in CPU Stress test (CPU-Z) the temp did not exceed 64c...

PS: I have removed previously ASUS Gamerfirst.

Could it be that Asus software is messing with everything?

Will keep testing...

giboune · ‎01-01-2021

I disabled CPB... no change. Disabled PBO is enough.

Did some of you success to register in Nvidia forum ?

Ero_Sennin · ‎12-26-2020

It's not only in Asus mohterboards. People with other motherboards also mentioned they have the same results. I hope Asus can offer new bios and agesa updates and AMD chipset drivers so it will work as it should. Because this cpu is totally new and the motherboards may need more optimization to handle it fine.

erdoc2 · ‎12-26-2020

One other thing I failed to mention. I flashed the BIOS with the new update last night and it had zero effect. I was so hoping that was it.

warpigs · ‎01-17-2021

I have a 5950x and an Asus Dark Hero in an O11 dynamic case + 360 galahad and I've noticed that at idle it randomly spikes to 80c only for a few seconds then goes back to 33c idle. I get startled because my fan suddenly revs up to max randomly. When I mean randomly, its like once or twice every 30 minutes. I sometimes leave my PC on with no apps running and from a far I will just hear it rev up.

Anyway, I had to reformat my PC multiple times and try to add programs one at a time, observe, then add another program, then observe.

So far I've noticed that the scenario that it made it happen:

PBO enabled + XMP - no other OC tweaks .. As soon as I installed the Asus Aura/Armoury Crate RGB software, the fans started to rev up. So I've been banging my head trying to figure out how to make it work like to the point I had to change the fan curves in the BIOS to not make it sound like an airplane during these random rev ups.

With PBO still enabled - I also tried changing the power plan for the minimum/maximum processor state to 98%/99% and that worked - no more rev ups. However, my R23/R20 single and multicore performance drops like CRAZY so that makes it an unacceptable solution. To the point that at 99% maximum processor state, the scores are way higher when PBO is off.

So yes, turning off PBO fixes it but it still spikes but not at 80c -- i only see 65c.

Clearly there is something wrong regardless PBO on or off.

So I did another reformat and about a few days ago I noticed that there is a new version of Armoury Create and a new Beta Dark hero BIOS (Version 3202) and I installed both.

With PBO on and all, it finally fixed the issue. Max temps I see at idle is only around 55c. Its like a miracle.

Now I have 3900x and TUF gaming X570 wifi that displays the exact same issue. I haven't updated the BIOS and Armoury create on that PC and Im curious to see if it will fix it without reformatting the hdd.

trek · ‎01-17-2021

It is clear why you have temp spikes, it is Asus apps., they do something in bacground probably very inefficiently and AMD cpus are boosting aggresively, with PBO on with motherboard limits everything is amplified.

It was the same with EPIC launcher and other apps.

I am not aware Asus being quality software development company, so their software corresponds to that.

warpigs · ‎01-17-2021

Definitely agree. But so far the latest versions of both the BIOS and the Asus RGB apps is not doing it anymore. I'm not sure what fixed it.

Streetfights · ‎01-18-2021

Just wanted to weigh in with my experiences and findings.

I installed the 5950 last week in my MSI X570 MEG Unify with the latest bios (non-beta), and was seeing all the symptoms identified in this thread.
I tried PBO auto/off/on/eco and there was literally zero effect, no matter what was selected.
I observed that Eco 95W straight-up just doesn’t work, as my CPU was still running at a constant 1.48v, 4900mhz 110W+ and hitting 79c gaming.

I then decided to apply a bios voltage offset of -.100v. My temps immediately dropped to 32c - 40c idle and 48c - 55c gaming.
However, my freq is now maxing out at 3.4ghz.

Regardless, I’m just going to live with the gimped perf for now to avoid getting choked out of my office by the heat until these issues get figured out. But I’m also considering returning the processor and getting a 5600 instead because the extra power is practically unusable in its current state. Super disappointing.

trek · ‎01-18-2021

Streefights, you bought high performance workstation processor 5950x and you are complaining about performance and related power consumption (which is btw smaller than Intel cpus and performance is much better), which is illogical.

As 5950x produces much less heat than Intel competing products which have worse performance your conclusions are invalid.

Nevertheless I have solution for you, you can set with 5950x desired throttling temperature you want in BIOS, it is called Plaform Thermal Throttle Limit and it will do what you need and want while keeping performance, set this limit to 70C if you want to have less than or equal temp to 70C for example, keep all other settings on Auto

This is advantage of Zen 3 processors, you can run them how you want. There is also new curve optimizer which allows undervolting and increasing performance - used with Plaform Thermal Throttle Limit I have better performance than stock with much lower temperatures.

Phucumol · ‎01-18-2021

Hi,

While i'm following this thread and trying all the things you guys mentioned, i noticed that neither my radiators nor the waterblock nor the water itself change in temperatur during cinebench.

I checked the pump: works fine

I checked the waterflow: all good

I checked the waterblock and even applied new thermalpast twice and still no difference.

So I turned off my pump to see if there is any difference in Cpu temp and I still get around 80°C.

That's odd isn't it

Chibi28 · ‎01-19-2021

@Phucumol wrote:
Hi,
While i'm following this thread and trying all the things you guys mentioned, i noticed that neither my radiators nor the waterblock nor the water itself change in temperatur during cinebench.
I checked the pump: works fine
I checked the waterflow: all good
I checked the waterblock and even applied new thermalpast twice and still no difference.
So I turned off my pump to see if there is any difference in Cpu temp and I still get around 80°C.
That's odd isn't it

I forgot to answer this as got sidetracked. Before I nerfed my CPU via settings and everything was running at default stock settings. I had a strange situation where when I ran the stress test from CPU-Z for like 5 minutes the temperature would go down by 10C and once the test was stopped the temp would go back to +10C. Never tried it long as I was scared to overheat the CPU, but water temp did increase too.

It did make me wonder if the temps were being reported accurately...Oh I have a vid of the stress test on my phone not 5 mins long though but enough to show the temp dropping.

Can you post vids on here?

astrosquirrel · ‎01-19-2021

Oh my dear god, this thread went from helpful to toxic flamewars. How embarrasing. I'm done with it.

For the ones that care, I've posted my specs before.

Today as I write, my temps range from a 42 degree idle. Yeah, there are spikes from time to time to the 60s but it quickly comes down.

84 degrees max while gaming.

Still for me to do:
Install the latest BIOS and apply under-volting offset using PBOII.

I am not sure I'll bother to place the results here as they seems to get drowned out by the trolling and whining.

trek · ‎01-19-2021

I will put here just my system settings and temperatures which many of you would consider as broken CPU, but for me it works as it should

In windows desktop "idle" ("idle" means in this thread arbitrary workload), I was just using my common applications, etc.

CPU (tcl/tdie) temperature - 37C - 80C
Cores boosting to 5040MHz
particular core vid 0.944V - 1.5V
max CPU usage 0.7% - 100%
VRM temp max 50C
PCH temp max 46C

as you see you I am providing important information, e.g. that during this "idle" as many here refer to I had 100% load from some applications and therefore boosts to 80C, only 80C because I set PBO thermal throttle limit to 80C

Many of you would RMA these results as defective CPU but it is not, everything is working properly, I have CPU fans set to minimum with fan curve ramping from 80C to 90C and all case fans are on fan stop and not running (they run as soon as internal temperature raises), because high temperatures/spikes are ok (if they are below or equal to 90C)

I have air cooling, with water cooling I would have better results because it would inhibit spikes more, but I do not need to, this is fine.

If on wants to evaluate CPU, she must open e.g. hwinfo for some time and measure all variables, graphs are possible and take a look what is idle and when and when there is load on CPU.

CalinB · ‎01-19-2021

I kept the cpu on full load for 2h rendering a video. The temp was 100c, fans at 100%, the water temp was 55c! Ambient temp 21c. If you’re telling me that this CPU should work like I don’t know what to say..

JoltCola · ‎01-19-2021

It should never get over 90C unless you increase the temp limit in PBO. If you didn't do that, something isn't right.

CalinB · ‎01-19-2021

I know, if you go a few pages before you can see what is happening with my build. I keep telling people that this is a software problem, but they seem some don’t want to listen..

trek · ‎01-20-2021

@CalinB wrote:
I kept the cpu on full load for 2h rendering a video. The temp was 100c, fans at 100%

Not possible unless you forgot to remote protective plastic film from coldplate or your temperature utility is reporting wrong temp.

Could you start Hwinfo - sensors, run rendering and make hwinfo screenshot all values?

Ero_Sennin · ‎01-20-2021

Sorry but it's possible. I have completely removed all the films from mobo and cooler back. When I used the PBO, CPB and I used the performance enhancer to Default or Level 1, when I run the CPU mark, the temps went 100-105c and PC rebooted.

Unfortunately I can't do it and show you again because I already sent the mobo to the shop for warranty stuff etc.

It seems the only key motherboard from Asus for the Ryzen 5950x as much as I read, is the Dark Hero because it has the Dynamic OC Switcher.

PC Processors

Ryzen 9 5950x Running at 74c, Is this a safe Temperature?