General Discussions

[GordonD]

I wanted a Ryzen 8600GE. They aren't available here in Australia. So I bought one on ebay from a seller in China with good feedback.

But it seems to be dead. I put it in a system. The system doesn't boot. Just the fan spins. Swap to a known good Ryzen and the system works.

There is talk of counterfeit AMD Ryzens around. Where can I find an authoritative image of what a Ryzen 5 Pro 8600GE should look like.

My suspicion it is a fake chip is raised by the fact it doesn't seem to have any of those components between the legs of the cover that are in all the images I can find of other Ryzen models.

[elstaci · Accepted solution]

Does the picture of the AMD Ryzen 5 Pro 8600GE look exactly like the one you received?

Did in come in a authentic sealed Official AMD RETAIL BOX?

Here is a link from AMD SUPPORT that tells you how to authenticate your AMD Processor and AMD Retail box: https://www.amd.com/en/resources/support-articles/warranty/PIB-Authenticity.html

If you are still unsure about your AMD 8600GE open a AMD SUPPORT - WARRANTY ticket and upload the processor's Serial Number and Model from the processor itself and from the Retail box. They can tell you if you have an authentic AMD processor or not.

[cwiggles · Accepted solution]

It could be  fake. DerBaoure did a video covering one of his subscribers who was sold a DEAd 7800X3D. Turned out to be a complete fake, no CPU at all, just a PCB with the heat spreader, no CPU die at all. 

Here's the video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7C_x5EI-fQ&pp=ygURZGViYW91cmUgZmFrZSBhbWQ%3D

Given the effort the people went through I doubt they are only doing 7800X3D fakes This is why I *never* buy online unless it's from a local stores website.

The best you can do is try to get a refund.

Craig 

[elstaci]

Please upload a close photo of your Ryzen 8600GE processor showing the top of the processors.

First did the processor come in a sealed Official AMD Retail box?  Does the AMD Retail Box outer white label that shows the Model and S/N of the processor match the same data on your processor's lid?

Here is close up of a Authentic AMD Ryzen 5 Pro 8600GE from AMD Support specs: https://www.amd.com/en/products/processors/desktops/ryzen-pro/8000-series/amd-ryzen-5-pro-8600ge.htm...

Does your processor look identical to the above photo if not then you have a Fake CPU. 

If your processor didn't come in a authentic sealed AMD Retail box then it is either a OEM/TRAY, Used, or Fake processor. Plus it doesn't qualify for AMD Three year Warranty for PIB (Processor in a Box).

Note: Ebay is very popular for selling fake or bad merchandise even though Ebay is trying to crack down on those type of Retailers/Vendors.

China is one area where a lot of fake merchandise is sold via Ebay and other Foreign EBAY Type sites.

[elstaci]

If the new processor doesn't boot up could several reasons besides being a fake:

1- Motherboard's UEFI BIOS version doesn't support the new processor so it isn't recognized nor boots up.

2- Motherboard's CPU LIST doesn't list the Pro 8600GE as being compatible

3-RAM is not compatible with the new processor

What Trouble LED or Digital codes or BEEP Sequences are showing when the PC doesn't boot up? 

I will show you how to troubleshoot your PC when it doesn't boot up by using UEFI BIOS and your motherboard's Trouble LED, Digital Codes, or Beep sequences once you post your PC hardware Make & Models and other PC information.

[GordonD]

Thank you for your assistance.

The motherboard is an ASUS A620M-AYW WIFI which ASUS says supports the Ryzen 5 PRO 8600GE from BIOS release 1807. The label on my motherboard says it was shipped with BIOS release 1811.

The RAM is compatible.

The dealer who sold me the motherboard tested it with another CPU, and said "no fault found", but won't look at my CPU because I didn't buy it from them, and the person I can talk to about the testing doesn't know what CPU it was tested with or what BIOS release displayed when it booted with that CPU. Its not their problem.

There is no diagnostic information to work on, because it doesn't do anything with the 8600GE in it. It just spins the fan.

[elstaci · Accepted solution]

Does the picture of the AMD Ryzen 5 Pro 8600GE look exactly like the one you received?

Did in come in a authentic sealed Official AMD RETAIL BOX?

Here is a link from AMD SUPPORT that tells you how to authenticate your AMD Processor and AMD Retail box: https://www.amd.com/en/resources/support-articles/warranty/PIB-Authenticity.html

If you are still unsure about your AMD 8600GE open a AMD SUPPORT - WARRANTY ticket and upload the processor's Serial Number and Model from the processor itself and from the Retail box. They can tell you if you have an authentic AMD processor or not.

[elstaci]

Okay lets assume you have a authentic Ryzen 5 Pro 8600GE processor. Since it won't boot up you will need to use your Motherboard's UEFI BIOS to locate the problematic hardware that is preventing your PC from booting up.

By the way this isn't a Prebuilt PC correct?  If this is a Pre-Built PC than open the Manufacturer's Warranty ticket to have the PC checked under Warranty.

You or someone else was the one that built the PC from scratch correct? Then continue on below.

First make sure you have the motherboard's 1 x 8-pin +12V Power connector connected. If this plug is not connected your PC won't boot up.

Second do a CLEAR CMOS of your BIOS or Reset your BIOS to its "Default" settings while you have the processor installed. This will make BIOS recognize the new processor.

Third it seems like your Motherboard doesn't have any Trouble LEDs or Digital Codes so you will need to install a PC SPEAKER (Very inexpensive) to hear the BEEP SEQUENCES as it boots up.

From your Asus Manual:

Trying to find out your Asus Motherboard BIOS Manufacturer whether it is  AMI or some other company BIOS to find the BEEP CODES for troubleshooting your PC. The Asus Manual doesn't state the BIOS company.

Fourth you can't update to the latest Asus BIOS Version 3024 since you PC won't boot up. But once you finally get it to boot up I suggest you update your out-dated BIOS Version 1811 to version 3024.

Fifth once you get the PC SPEAKER connected and it is working disconnect all hardware from your Motherboard EXCEPT the PSU, CPU, CPU COOLER, Windows  Drive.  Make sure all PSU cables are connected to the Motherboard.

Power up and listen to the BEEP CODES as it boots up.

Seems like the BEEP CODES are the same for most Asus Motherboards. Found this tech site that give you the meanings of the BEEP Sequence codes: https://www.technewstoday.com/asus-beep-codes/

When you power up with just the PSU, CPU, and Windows drive you should hear One BEEP and 2 short BEEPS indicating that there is an problem with your System RAM since no RAM is installed.  This also means that UEFI BIOS checked your processor and it passed it BIOS Test and continued to check the other hardware.

But if you hear 5 Short BEEPS that indicates that UEFI BIOS found something wrong with your processor or CPU and stopped the booting process.

Now that would indicate either a defective Motherboard or CPU or possibly a PSU Power issue. Since your Motherboard booted up with different Ryzen installed that would strongly suggest you have a bad CPU. I then would open a AMD WARRANTY TICKET to have it checked or replaced under Warranty.

Now lets say your processor passed BIOS test and the Motherboard BEEP Sequence is indicating a RAM System issue ( One BEEP and Two Short BEEPS) 

Now install just one RAM Stick in the Appropriate DIMM Slot and see if you now hear One BEEP and 3 short BEEPS indicating no GPU card installed or not working.

Now install your GPU card and connect your Keyboard and Mouse, Monitor and boot up again. If you hear One short BEEP that means all hardware passed BIOS Test and now is booting up into Windows. 

[GordonD]

Thank you for your comprehensive reply, but it may be how well colours display on my screen or my own elderly eyes, but I can't read anything that you have accented in yellow. Which makes your response completely incomprehensive because I can't read precisely the things you think are important.

Its a motherboard with a CPU that has integrated GPU, and RAM. Everything bought separately. And everything tested as working, except the CPU.

I think we are well passed the point where it could be assumed its an authentic AMD CPU.

[elstaci]

Sorry didn't realize you couldn't read the Yellow highlighted text. I changed it back to White again.

I don't believe you have a authentic AMD CPU by the EBAY Photo Link you posted.

Can you upload a close photo of the CPU you received from EBAY from the top?

If the CPU is a fake that is why it won't boot up. It might be a CPU that is incompatible with your motherboard.

Which is why you should open a AMD SUPPORT - WARRANTY Ticket to see if it is really a OEM/TRAY Ryzen 8600GE or a fake by the serial number imprinted on the CPU lid.

[GordonD]

I found that image. And that's what worries me. It doesn't look like that.

The labelling doesn't look like that. It doesn't say RYZEN AI.

And, as I said, those components between the legs of the cover are simply not there.

It didn't come in a retail AMD box, I assumed it was OEM/tray.

This is what it looks like:

AMD Ryzen 5 PRO 8600GE AM5 3.9 GHz 6-Core R5 PRO 8600GE 16MB 35W CPU Processor | eBay

[elstaci]

Sounds like you got ripped off with a fake CPU.

Since it didn't come in a Official AMD RETAIL BOX the AMD WARRANTY is voided and the Warranty needs to come from the Retailer/Vendor that sold you the processor.

But even if the AMD is not a Fake and is authentic since it didn't come in a AMD Retail Box means it is a OEM/TRAY processor that is not covered by AMD WARRANTY of three years and is warrantied only by the Retailer/Vendor that sold you the processor.

Here is AMD SUPPORT, EBAY, and a Testing CPU Tech site photos. The photos from AMD and the Testing CPU Tech site looks identical to each other not like the EBAY photo:

When I googled the Model number from your EBAY photo it comes up as a OEM/TRAY Processor and led me to this European Retailer website:

But if your CPU doesn't have any of those side exposed contacts you were sold a fake CPU.

NOTE: On the  EBAY photo it shows the Manufacturer's date as being in 2022 while AMD Support states the Launch Date as 04/16/2024.

The only thing I can figure out is the CPU Lid on the EBAY Processor was screen painted on. 

Open a AMD SUPPORT - WARRANTY ticket and input the CPU Serial Number and Model Number and see what AMD says that processor is from here: https://www.amd.com/en/forms/contact-us/support.html

[GordonD]

So its pretty clear from the fact that an image of it does not match images from elsewhere of that AMD processor.

And ebay has a policy of refunding in the case of counterfeits/fakes.

But how do I prove to ebay that it is? Ebay wants some sort of certification.

So who can I go to who will certify it as a fake? The computer store I bought the rest of the stuff from, and tested it and declared "no fault found" with it, says the CPU is nothing to do with them, they didn't sell it to me.

And AMD won't communicate with ordinary end users of their products.

I'd sort of hoped that there might have been some official AMD moderator on this site who'd step in to protect the company when it seemed like that was what was required.

[elstaci]

Send Ebay a photo of the fake CPU and a photo of a authentic CPU. Also send them a copy of your Retailer's Receipt which should indicate a description of the processor you purchased.

Also even though you don't have a AMD Warranty, AMD SUPPORT can probably check the Serial Number of the Fake CPU and let you know if the processor is authentic or not. Also upload a photo of the fake CPU.

Take a photo using your Cellphone Camera then upload to your PC.

Let them know the reason why you opened a AMD Support ticket. If AMD Support responds back saying that is not a authentic 8600GE  (Retail nor OEM/TRAY) you can upload that response to Ebay to let them know you received a fake CPU as further proof which is verified by AMD.

Ebay uses Paypal so they will contact the Retailer for their version of the transaction.

The computer shop probably doesn't want to install the possibly fake processor since it wasn't purchased from their store because if they install the processor and damages the Motherboard they may be responsible. just my opinion or guess.

NOTE: AMD Moderators reads or are aware all threads generated at AMD Forums.  If they feel it is important issue they will notify the applicable department. 

I'll tag a AMD Moderator and see if he replies to the thread or not just to make him aware of your problem. Sometimes due to the nature of the problem they may not be legally be able to answer in certain situations. @Matt_AMD  or @Ray_AMD or @Wally_AMD 

[cwiggles · Accepted solution]

It could be  fake. DerBaoure did a video covering one of his subscribers who was sold a DEAd 7800X3D. Turned out to be a complete fake, no CPU at all, just a PCB with the heat spreader, no CPU die at all. 

Here's the video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7C_x5EI-fQ&pp=ygURZGViYW91cmUgZmFrZSBhbWQ%3D

Given the effort the people went through I doubt they are only doing 7800X3D fakes This is why I *never* buy online unless it's from a local stores website.

The best you can do is try to get a refund.

Craig 

[GordonD]

It is a fake. That's pretty well definitively established as a result of the helpful information I've gotten here.

Someone has gone to a lot of trouble to manufacture what are apparently very good copies of AMD CPUs. But under the lid there's no silicon chip.

I'm currently trying to figure out what to do.

Sure, I could return it, and get my money back. And the seller would then sell it to someone else.

I've tried to get the computer press here in Australia interested. They could de-lid it and show there's nothing under the hood. And show other people what to look for - the older style of text on the lid and the absence of the components around the outside - but I can't get anyone interested.

What is amazing is that this seller has 3K+ sales and a 99.5% rating on ebay. But he tried it on with me twice. The first try was sending a substitute old used Intel chip, expecting to be able to accuse me of trying to scam him. But I opened the package in front of a witness. Then his replacement for that when he was caught was a completely fake chip.

I've reported it to ebay as a fake/counterfeit, but I've gotten no response. At least that option would result in my getting my money back and the item destroyed rather than being returned to the seller to scam someone else with.

[elstaci]

I can understand using that particular Seller to purchase merchandise from his Online store according to its Customer's Ratings but I don't understand if the Seller tried to rip you off once why you would again trust him to send you a replacement that is an expensive computer hardware from him?

I would have immediately asked for a total Refund and reported him to Ebay and give that store a very bad review and warning to other customers about his criminal behavior.

Anyway, Paypay should refund you money and hopefully Ebay will ban that Store/Seller from using eBay in the future.

[GordonD]

That's totally not how eBay works.

eBay just says the ONLY way to get your money back is to return the item, and when you do that whatever feedback you've given gets deleted. So scammers get to try it again on the next unsuspecting sucker.

ebay makes money from sales whether they are honest or scams. It doesn't see it as in its interest to ban anyone doing transactions, whether they are doing scams or honest.

And you can't sue the scammers when they are in China.

[elstaci]

True, but Ebay has a responsibility in preventing criminal activities on their Online website by investigating and banning those Stores that sells illegal merchandise. Otherwise they will get bad reputation and Users will stop using ebay to purchase merchandise in the future.

I read a few years ago that Ebay was cracking down on many of these Sellers/Vendors that sells fake or illegal merchandise.

Just googled about how to report Online Retailers that sells fake or illegal Merchandise and found this US Government agency you can report it to: https://www.stopfakes.gov/Reporting-an-Online-Vendor-Selling-Fakes

Contact either the US CONSUMER'S PRODUCT SAFETY COMMISSION or FBI.

NOTE: I would take extensive photos of the fake CPU and make copies of all transaction and shipping documents in case one of the two departments asks for evidence. 

If you are not going to send the processor back to the Vendor then you can see if one of the departments would like to have it to inspect or as evidence.

Anyways, Good Luck and hope you are able to resolve your problem in your favor.

Take care.

[GordonD]

Thanks for the info, but there's not a lot of point me reporting it to a US agency.

I'm in Australia.

[elstaci]

Sorry about that forgot that you mentioned you lived in Australia.

So googled the same question for Australia and found a similar Consumer Agency (Non-Governmental)  to report your fake CPU to: https://counterfeit.com.au/

From the link above - Counterfeit.com.au

Have you been scammed? Been supplied a fake product? Let us help you

With an explosion in online shopping across the world, scammers are making billions of dollars each year from the unsuspecting public by faking branded products. From cosmetics to shoes to aircraft parts, nothing is out of their reach from cosmetics to shoes to aircraft parts, nothing is out of their reach.

If you have bought a product that you think is fake and you are having trouble getting your money back, then we can help.

Send us a report about your experience. Or for a modest fee Counterfeit Australia will use its multiple resources to assist you to recover your money. We will do our best to succeed, but of course it's not possible to succeed every time. However, we have a good track record of obtaining refunds and putting scammers out of business.

Rapid Antigen Test Kits (RAT) are in high demand and of course scammers are already producing fake tests which do not show usable results due to a lack of reactive agent in the kit. If you have purchased a suspect RAT kit or come across a kit that you believe to be counterfeit, please let us know and we will follow this up immediately

Edit: I was going to delete the information concerning the US Government agency in my previous reply but decided to leave it in case a US User ends up in a similar situation as yours.

[elstaci]

Okay found the equivalent U.S. Consumer Protections Agency in Australia: https://www.accc.gov.au/media-release/dont-get-scammed-by-a-fake-online-store

If nothing else they might be able to direct to the correct Government agency to report your Fake CPU.

[elstaci]

By the way, how much did you pay for your fake CPU on Ebay?

[GordonD]

And, Paypal won't help me unless I contacted the seller, and accepted his offer to return it for refund.

They encourage outright fraud too.

[cwiggles]

To the OP,

try reaching out to Hardware Unboxed. Steve or Tim may be interested in covering this, especially seeing they are Australian as well. 

Craig

[GordonD · Accepted solution]

This is going to surprise you all.

The Answer to "Have I got a real AMD CPU?" turned out in the end to be YES.

After it looked like the seller tried to scam me initially with a substitute old CPU, then the more real looking one he sent me didn't work, I was convinced it was a non-functional counterfeit/fake, especially when it didn't look at all  like the official AMD images of that processor model.

I was wrong.

The official images AMD publish of that CPU model on its web site and in the images it provides of its retail boxes do not correct depict it. It doesn't have RYZEN AI PRO on it like the AMD images. It has the same print style on it as 7000 series CPUs. It doesn't have those little components between the legs of the lid.

And after a 7000 series CPU was used to test if the motherboard was OK, and there was no problem, then a replacement 8600G CPU was purchased and it worked too, the 8600GE I purchased from the seller was tried and it worked this time. So it not working initially seemed to be because of some issue with the ASUS A620M-AYW motherboard's BIOS.

So I apologise to the seller. Whether he did try to scam me, or it was just a shipping mistake as he claimed, the 8600GE he sent me was a real working AMD Ryzen 5 PRO 8600GE. And I've now wasted $AU288 on another CPU to find that out. Thanks AMD and ASUS for being as unhelpful in sorting this out as you have been.