PC Processors

[BlackCastle]

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 5700X

Motherboard: Asus TUF x570 GAMING PLUS (Wi-Fi)

RAM : Corsair Vengence LPX DDR4 3200 MHz 16GB x 2

BIOS Version: 5013
CPU Cooler: Deepcool AK620; On Avg room temperature, the CPU reaches a max temp of 65 Degree Celcius, and on a hot day with room temp from 40-45 Degree Celcius, it reaches up to 70-75 Degree Celcius. I have a total of 2 140mm intake fans on the front and 3 exhaust fans on the top and one 140mm rear exhaust fans.

D.C.O.P : Enable
PBO : Disabled

Curve Optimizer : Set to Negative 15

All drivers are up to date including the chipset driver.

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Hi, I am using the above mentioned Config. My CPU used to get locked at 3.8 GHz during heavy load and CPU Stress Test. I have a friend who uses MSI B450M Mortax Max. He uses the same CPU as me. His CPU reaches the advertised Boost Clock during heavy load after he had set curve optimizer to "Negative 25". I had tried that too but mine only had an improvement of 200 MHz max. It now reaches up to 4.00 GHz. Mostly fluctuates between 3.9-4.0. I currently have the curve optimizer set to "Negative 15" and still I get the same result. I heard from reviewers on YT that enabling PBO is a bad idea. So, if anyone here using the same Motherboard as me and the CPU, have you managed to make it reach the full boost clock and if so, how? Or, what settings should I change in the BIOS the achieve the boost clock.
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NOTE: Aside from the Curve Optimizer, I haven't changed anything. 

[misterj]

BlackCastle, I think you need to try PBO. Please post a screenshot of Ryzen Master (RM) running Cinebench R24. Thanks and enjoy, John.

[BlackCastle]

Should I enable PBO before running Cinebench and send you the screenshot or run Cinebench with the PBO disabled first?

[misterj]

BlackCastle, both would be great, order does not matter. Thanks and enjoy, John.

[BlackCastle]

Cinebench Single Core_1Cinebench Single Core_2Cinebench Multi Core_1Cinebench Multi Core_2

[BlackCastle]

These are without PBO enabled. I took them yesterday. I'll send screenshots with PBO enabled in a few hours after I get back home.

[FunkZ]

It is primarily the PPT limit of only 76W that prevents higher all-core clocks on the 5700X. This is set intentionally to reduce power as the CPU is a 65W TDP part.

In my post below I detail the PBO limits I am using, which are essentially the factory limits on a 105W TDP chip like the 5800X.

[BlackCastle]

PBO Enabled Single CorePBO Enabled MultiCorePBO Was Set to "Auto", changed to "Enabled"

[BlackCastle]

A few things I forgot to mention, Global C State is turned off. I heard from a friend a few months ago that CPU don't reach the full boost clock due to low voltage so adding (+) offset voltage could do the trick. I tried adding offset voltage of (+0.100) volt but it had a negative result instead. My CPU which used to get locked at 3.8, after increasing the voltage, it used to get locked at 2.8 GHz; A full 1 GHz decrease!!

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I heard the curve optimizer from a friend's associate and he told me that by default Asus boards push a lot of voltage for the 5000 series cpus than necessary which hold the 5000 cpus back. In his opinion, the lower the voltage the better the performance.

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Now after enabling PBO, I can see that it reaches up to 4.5 GHz. Now, is the high voltage holding it back? I already have Negative 15 in the curve optimizer which is now showing 1.2V on full load and when I had Negative 25, it used to show (maybe) 1.1V.

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I also have one more thing I want to discuss. The electricity bill. Recently the government has again increased the electricity cost and my friend told me that their electricity bill came high after he installed R7 5700X. It was not skyrocketingly high, but was high enough to get him an earful from his father. It was probably because of the high voltage. So after the undervolted, the bill cam lower.

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So, I want to go as low as possible without hurting my system. I have a Corsair HX850 80+ Platinum; So power delivery should not be an issue. I want my system to get as much power as it needs but not go over than what it needs. Like, I don't wanna push unnecessary voltage constantly. So what is the appropriate settings in my case should be?

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I also don't want to use 4.6 GHz constant. My plan is for the CPU to automatically lock itself at 4.5 GHz under full load and use a little bit more than the minimum voltage. For example, the CPU can reach 4.5 GHz at 0.9V. I want to leave room for it to use a bit more if necessary. I don't want to starve my system of power but also don't wanna go crazy.

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Also, I saw that when I was stress testing the CPU with AIDA64, the temperature sometimes reached 90 and maybe crossed it. The operating temp of 5700x is stated as 90 Degrees. Is it reaching this much temp because of high voltage as well and if so, I need to lower it. However, on cinebench the temp was around 85 Degrees. Not sure if it would sound crazy, but I want to keep it below 85. At most, 80 Degrees would be nice and if lower is possible with my cooler that would be a miracle, I understand my cooler is not an AIO, so what I am implying is going as low as possible without hurting the performance.

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Note: I am quite new at undervolting, so if any of my thoughts sound crazy or outrageous, please treat it with a forgiving look. Thanks in advance.

[FunkZ]

First, congrats at reaching 4.5GHz boost. Increasing PBO limits allows the CPU to increase clock speed automatically (along with voltage) to reach higher speeds when needed. Another benefit to using PBO and leaving the multiplier on Auto allows the CPU to reduce clock speeds and voltage when not needed to save power and reduce heat.

Second, you're currently at -15 CO, you can likely go lower. Try -20, and if all is good, -25. The more negative CO you apply the less voltage it uses. Most motherboards, not just Asus, tend to overvolt the CPU. Per your screenshots above your core voltage is now around 1.30V which is not that high.

Third, you can't have higher CPU speed but lower power consumption, they go together. Your stock PPT was limiting the CPU to 76W and you were only getting 3.9-4.0GHz. Now your CPU is hitting up to 4.5GHz but it's using 105W at that speed. That's the tradeoff.

Fourth, electricity bill, seriously? You're talking the difference between 76W and 105W. There is no way upgrading to a 5700X was even noticeable on the electricity bill. At USA average $0.15/kWh (1,000 Watt hour) the stock 76W costs $0.27/day and the overclocked 105W costs $0.38/day - and that's if you ran it at 100% for 24 hours. Gaming for a couple hours a day might be a difference of 1 or 2 cents.

[misterj]

BlackCastle, I have to admit I have not read all of your long reply but what you reinforced is that a lot of users have a friend(s) advised them to set of not set this or that or a YT or website advising to set or reset some parameter(s). What I failed to tell you that I always should tell all users is do a Clear CMOS to get rid of all these questionable settings and uninstall all utilities not from AMD. These all lead to heartache. Then when the problem is understood, the user can play with any/all parameters and have fun. The truth is Ryzen processors do a fantastic job of managing themselves. I hope all is running well and you are meeting your desired boost clocks. Thanks and enjoy, John.

[FunkZ · Accepted solution]

5700X - 4850Mhz single/4650Mhz all-core using the following settings. Cooling is custom loop, mid-70°'s all-core load temp

PPT Limit increase from 76 to 140
TDC Limit increase from 60 to 90
EDC Limit increase from 90 to 140
(these are essentially the stock settings on a 105W TDP chip)
CO (Curve Optimizer) All-Core -25 (-30 was unstable)
CPU Boost Clock Override (Auto OC) +200

https://valid.x86.fr/r8y0wz

 

[misterj]

Thanks, FunkZ. Looks like you are slightly exceeding specifications. All looks good! Looking forward to seeing BlackCastle results.

I should point out that I still have my old 3970X with no CO and know little about it. Thanks and enjoy, John.

[FunkZ]

OP stated "I heard from reviewers on YT that enabling PBO is a bad idea."

Works fine for me. Use it on all my Ryzen processors.

Unlike Voltage Offset, Curve Optimizer doesn't affect the core voltage by a fixed amount. It shifts the voltage-frequency curve by +30 to -30, which for any given clock speed will alter the applied voltage by anywhere from 3-6mV per increment. Because it's a curve rather than a straight line, voltage adjustments at the top of the frequency curve will be affected more (+/-6mV) than those near the bottom (+/-3mV).

[misterj]

Thanks, FunkZ.

[BlackCastle]

Did you set all these parameters from Ryzen Master only or from BIOS too? I noticed that there are two overclocking options in Asus BIOS, one is the AI Overclock Tuner and the other is AMD Overclocking. I turned on PBO from AI Overclocking but I don't see options for PPT, TDC and EDC under Ai Overclock Tuner's PBO settings. Are these found under AMD Overclocking settings in the BIOS?

[FunkZ]

Under AMD Overclocking there should be a setting for PBO Limits which must be changed from Auto to Manual in order to set PPT, TDC and EDC to user-defined values. There is likely another setting option such as Motherboard or similar that sets manufacturer pre-defined limits which are typically so high it effectively negates all limits.

[BlackCastle]

If I use the AMD Overclocking, should I "disable" or set "Auto" PBO from AI Overclock? 

[FunkZ]

AMD Overclocking, PBO Auto means all you will get is the default Precision Boost of the processor. Have to change that to Advanced to open up Overdrive options.

 

[BlackCastle]

Sorry for the late reply. What I meant to say was, Asus boards have 2 overclocking system. 1) Ai Tweaker 2) AMD Overclocking. #2 is found under Advanced Tab. Inside the AMD Overclocking, you can manually add the PPT, EDC, TDC values. It also has PBO, curve optimizer among other things. So my question is, since the board has 2 overclocking system, should I set the PBO from AI Tweaker "Auto" and enable the one inside AMD Overclocking and add manual values?

[FunkZ]

Yes, it can be confusing having similar options available in two different places in the BIOS. BTW Asus is not the only manufacturer that does this, my Gigabyte boards have the same duplication of settings.

As you point out, not all options available under AMD Overclocking are necessarily included in the Tweaker section. Attempting to configure the same settings in two different places could cause conflicts or have unintended results. These sections should be used as an "either-or" and not in combination.

Consider Tweaker as an "Easy" mode, and AMD Overclocking as "Advanced". If Tweaker has all the options you want to change then use the Tweaker settings and leave the Advanced alone. Similarly, if you want to use the advanced options in AMD Overclocking then don't touch the Tweaker settings, leave them at default.

[BlackCastle]

I added the values you suggested. However, I didn't add the boost clock override yet, I kept it disabled. However the boost clock is stuck like before. When I enabled the PBO from Ai Tweaker, it used to get locked at 4.4 too. I added the -25 from curve optimizer under the AMD Overclocking. Is there anything else I can do to make it reach the full boost clock. I'm actually trying to test if I lost the silicon lottery or not. Since it reaches 4.4 under full load, I think it might reach the full boost too. So, wondering if there is anything else that needs to be done.

[FunkZ]

Ryzen Master is showing your Max CPU Speed as 4,600 and this would normally show 4,650 by default so there may be an extraneous setting somewhere getting applied. If you add the max +200 boost clock override this should change to 4,850. But 50MHz won't make much difference as more importantly it's reporting 86°C with 1.22V core voltage applied.

Gamers Nexus review of your Deepcool AK620 ranks it at +53°C over ambient on a 123W load, (100% fan speed) so if your internal case temp is low-30°C's then it's performing as expected and you're unlikely to get much more clock speed out of the chip, at least not with the 100% all-core workload (Cinebench) being used to test. Remember that's a worst case scenario as with single core or reduced loads it should boost higher.

If you want to see how the CPU is performing while gaming for example, turn on the Adrenalin Metric Overlay and make sure CPU Frequency is selected and you can monitor it while in-game.

[BlackCastle]

Hi, sorry for the late reply. The past couple of weeks have been exhausting. I mainly bought that cooler after seeing Gamer Nexus's reviews, as it was a good option in my budget. Also, I am not too fond of AIOs / liquid coolers since there's a fear of leakage. I live in a country where it gets pretty hot during the summer. Currently, the summer season is in play, and my room temperature gets up to 41 degrees Celsius during the day and about 35 during the night. Therefore, the idle temp of the CPU sits around 45-50. You mentioned about extraneous settings getting applied somewhere. I didn't change anything in the BIOS other than what you suggested. What do you think? What settings could be getting applied that might be holding the CPU back or is it because of thermal limits?

[misterj]

BlackCastle, do not forget about:

Please run Cinebench R24 Single Core and post a screenshot of RM. Nothing else should be running on your system. Thanks, John.

 

[BlackCastle]

The single core reaches 4.6 GHz but not all cores. Since, FunkZ was able to reach 4.6 GHz all cores, that is why I am wondering if the board or temperature holding the CPU back from reaching max clock all cores. I increased the PPT to 150, EDC to 100 and TDC to 150, boost clock override to +200 and ran the single core test again. This time the single core reached 4.8 GHz but all core is still stuck at 4.5 GHz. My friend had a b450 Tomahawk and was able to reach 4.6 all cores. So wondering if the board or something else is holding it back from reaching max clock all cores or is it temperature. My drivers are all up to date.

[misterj]

BlackCastle, your processor is specified by AMD to reach "...up to 4.6GHz...". Your processor is reaching that. You and your friend should discuss the differences. Good luck. John.

[FunkZ]

I suspect temperature is the difference here. You're using air cooling with an ambient 35-40°C whereas I'm using water cooling with an ambient of 23°C.

[BlackCastle]

Hmm, I think that might be the case or the board. Me and my friend both live in the same ambient temperature. Although, I strongly feel that the board could be holding it back but then again, tomahawk is quite better compared to what I have even if it is a series behind and he uses Deepcool Ak400. As for temperature, I guess I gotta wait for winter and that is probably another 5-6 months away. During that time, the ambient temperature drops lowest 20 degrees and test again for max clock speed. Well, thanks for your insights. I really appreciate it.

[Matt_AMD]

Disabling C States is not recommended. I'd consider re-enabling them, as it allows idle cores to go into a low power (sleeping) state, which can save power. That power can then go into other cores that are awake and active with work, allowing for potentially a higher clock speed/performance.

[astrakan]

Hi

In case it could help, here are my settings for a 5700x Tropical PBO OC (30,5°C in my room...) :

CO : -25

PPT-TDC-EDC = 115-78-135 (Gives 100% for each in Ryzen Master)

CPU Boost Override: 200

Freq : 4.55Ghz All cores; 4.85Ghz one core (I see two at 4.85Ghz at one time)

Idle Temp : 36°

Full load Temp with cinebench : 83°

I use an old Noctua NH-U12P from 2009 (was for an i7 920) with only one FAN NF-S12B + thermal paste Cooler Master Cryofuse Violet.

MB : MSI B550 Gaming Plus

Regards.