5 Replies Latest reply on Aug 19, 2016 9:58 PM by catchabreak

    Why AMD cards dont perform better?

    abi

      This is something that riddles me for some time, and became more evident with the new Nvidia Pascal cards. If we compare AMD with Nvidia cards just by looking on the hardware side, for exmple the new GTX 1060 with RX 480 , we will see  a clear  advantage for the RX480. More compute power, more Vram, more bus interface,.....

       

      rx gtx.jpg

      But when we come to real life and see DX11 benchmarks, 1060 is a clear FPS winner, for DX12 benchmarks RX480 comes on top but still not far away from 1060.

       

      So my first thought was, probably there is a problem with the API or with the game engine itslef that doesnt allow the AMD cards to perform better.  But  at this moment I dont feel this is the case. Why??? for 3 reasons:

       

      1.  consoles, they use AMD hardware and are able of make full use of theyr processing power.

       

      2. Vulkan, if we see DOOM benchamrk RX480 is near gtx 980

       

      3. Nvidia cards have physix feature that lowers CPU usage comparing to AMD cards, however consoles dont show this problem.

       

      And by this reason i believe that AMD cards can't place theyr true power on games because of  AMD  drivers themselfs. There is a clear problem with AMD drivers performing on DX 11 and still on DX12. The only API that unlock card full power is vulkan

       

      Nvidia for some time that makes huge efforts to provide the best Drivers for new games, AMD on the other side make huge effort to place more powerfull cards to deal with theyr own drivers bottleneck. Am i wrong?

        • Re: Why AMD cards dont perform better?
          black_zion

          Yea, you're wrong. Most game studios have deals with nVidia which allows them to have a performance advantage. AMD does the best they can considering they have to deal with proprietary GameWorks coding, uncooperative game studios, and buggy games.

            • Re: Why AMD cards dont perform better?
              abi

              Naughty dog makes exclusive games for sony since ps1, 343 makes exclusives for Microsoft. Other editors while games are being ported  to PC Nvidia goest to the studios and makes sure theyr  cards perform the best they can. What is AMD strugle, why they dont help the developers like they did on doom?

              • Re: Why AMD cards dont perform better?
                conqueror

                I think you're wrong somehow, everything he posted in here is facts including that Nvidia give more access and optimize to games.

                 

                But he missed 2 things...

                1. He mintioned that dx12 works better with Radeon than Geforce, it's so easy, opposite for Nvidia. This focus on DX11 access and that DX12. But the point is most of games released until now based on OpenGL and DX11, and this is why you see Nvidia performes more. In the future you will see more DX12 games becasue it's the latest version, and i think this has some part of AMD needs to play.

                The only thing i really think about that AMD needs to improve OpenGL overall performances, this way will be a huge lead over Nvidia, not only with DX12 and Vulkan but with other basic API.

                 

                2. He forget about "Processor Speed, MHz" There's a huge difference between Nvidia and AMD processor speed, and this what boosts the performance basically, and seems it's leading with older API opened more access to Nvidia, if you think of that you will see that difference, AMD with lower speed leading in the newest API! this is the power difference he is talking about, but still i'm not satify with OpenGL, with DX12 and Vulkan i'm very satisfy that AMD is leading (BUT i need more games with that).

                 

                 

                Edit:

                I forget to mention, Doom Vulkan RX480 is better than GTX980, most benchmarks on youtube are fake and from the most known uploaders, i've RX480 OpenGL Ultra SMAA4, hight motion blur i gets avg 100fps 1080p. Vulkan same settings with TSAA16 i think(the max) i gets avg120fps. I hope we will see more Vulkan in more games.

                IMPORTANT that if you look att all Nvidia benchamarks with games support Nvidia tech you will see that all benchmarks been taken while Hairworks and Physx is off.

                 

                If you read what i posted you will understand 100% why, simply they can't focus on 2 DX versions, i'm happy that AMD focusing on the new one including a new API called Vulkan, it's just a matter of time for more DX12 in games, just like when there was DX9 and then came DX10 etc...

              • Re: Why AMD cards dont perform better?
                warsun

                The correct answer is Nvidia Gameworks.Or as people are calling it.Gimpworks.Any title that gets ready to come out.Nvidia finds out.An they rush to kick down their door an say.HERE! Throws money at them an they say.This is what we need you to do.use our Black box PhysX system.Look you can make clouds water an everything! Let us handle that.

                 

                Then ruin any game making frame rates 45fps.Because Tessellation is at 5X what it should be.Just on clouds,God rays,Ground textures,Water meshes an over flooding of trees an shadows.Just like in Fallout 4.Performance is garbage after that.You cant blame AMD for that.You can blame AMD for not preparing for this.This is why the new RX series is out there.No longer will it have high amounts of Pixels.If game developers want to make programs for AMD.They are gonna have too do it on Current AMD Cards.Which do not have that many Pixels.

                 

                      NVidia agents will try to make these changes an then see.The RX 480 itself does not use that many pixels an will refuse to make changes.An say that is not to their companies ideas.An we can say goodbye to Nvidia Gameworks.But it should not end there.Vulkan can fix Old games.So they should be setting up Vulkan patches for Games that are forcing Nvidia Gameworks.PhysX on by default.Fixing most issues.This will not save Fallout 4.Fallout 4 textures themselves are 8K just for the dirt.An in cities its embarrassing.Even on Nvidia cards.

                 

                The biggest advantage AMD has is faster ram an way more Textures to load faster.The better rendering the faster the performance.

                • Re: Why AMD cards dont perform better?
                  catchabreak

                  when it comes down to it NVidia are better at getting game designers to import there software into the games. NVidia seams to be a more if its not broken don't fix it just enough solution were as AMD tries to put too much into there designs taking its toll on chip speed and fps